7 replies to this topic

[ScottK2001]

.25-.25 NL game. I am in the small blind with 2s 2h. This was my second or third hand at the table, so I had no information on any of the other players.Guy in first position raises it to $2, and there are 4 callers ahead of me, so I call.Flop 2d 8c 10s. I check, the original raiser bets $5, the next guy raises it to $15, one folds. I call for $15, the original bettor goes all-in for $80, and the raiser (who also had about $80 left) calls immediately. I have about $70 left. I really felt like I was beat, but all I could think of was Harrington's book where he says that people who flop sets and fold (with no straights or flush possibilities on the board) are idiots.Was I supposed to call or fold?

[Scott3705]

Fold. It's clear your beaten. there's not really any draws here and people aren't going to play top pair, over pairs and two pairs like this. Set is the only possible hand.Now that the results based thinking is gone. You have to call. You ran into a set here. shit happens. Over pairs two pairs and tptk play this hand the same way

[iggymcfly]

ScottK2001 said:

.25-.25 NL game.  I am in the small blind with 2s 2h.  This was my second or third hand at the table, so I had no information on any of the other players.Guy in first position raises it to $2, and there are 4 callers ahead of me, so I call.Flop 2d 8c 10s.  I check, the original raiser bets $5, the next guy raises it to $15, one folds.  I call for $15, the original bettor goes all-in for $80, and the raiser (who also had about $80 left) calls immediately.  I have about $70 left.  I really felt like I was beat, but all I could think of was Harrington's book where he says that people who flop sets and fold (with no straights or flush possibilities on the board) are idiots.Was I supposed to call or fold?

I bolded the key part of the OP. If you were playing 5/5 and two people got all-in for $1600, then you could think about folding a set on the flop. In this kind of a game though, the hand range your up against includes JJ-AA, T8, J9, 97, maybe even T2, 82, and AT. You're going to have to pay this one off; sorry.Again, against a good player, you can use a specific hand range. I was reading Ace on the River the other day, and Barry Greenstein was talking about a tournament where he folded QQ on a board of A-Q-x-x-x for a pot-sized bet on the river because he knew the other guy had AA. In a .25/.25 game however, you'll be surprised how many times you win a pot in this kind of situation.

[Chief]

id call here

[portcityplayer]

iggymcfly said:

ScottK2001 said:

.25-.25 NL game. I am in the small blind with 2s 2h. This was my second or third hand at the table, so I had no information on any of the other players.Guy in first position raises it to $2, and there are 4 callers ahead of me, so I call.Flop 2d 8c 10s. I check, the original raiser bets $5, the next guy raises it to $15, one folds. I call for $15, the original bettor goes all-in for $80, and the raiser (who also had about $80 left) calls immediately. I have about $70 left. I really felt like I was beat, but all I could think of was Harrington's book where he says that people who flop sets and fold (with no straights or flush possibilities on the board) are idiots.Was I supposed to call or fold?

I bolded the key part of the OP. If you were playing 5/5 and two people got all-in for $1600, then you could think about folding a set on the flop. In this kind of a game though, the hand range your up against includes JJ-AA, T8, J9, 97, maybe even T2, 82, and AT. You're going to have to pay this one off; sorry.Again, against a good player, you can use a specific hand range. I was reading Ace on the River the other day, and Barry Greenstein was talking about a tournament where he folded QQ on a board of A-Q-x-x-x for a pot-sized bet on the river because he knew the other guy had AA. In a .25/.25 game however, you'll be surprised how many times you win a pot in this kind of situation.

SHOVE AND SAY A PRAYER!

[portcityplayer]

iggymcfly said:

ScottK2001 said:

.25-.25 NL game. I am in the small blind with 2s 2h. This was my second or third hand at the table, so I had no information on any of the other players.Guy in first position raises it to $2, and there are 4 callers ahead of me, so I call.Flop 2d 8c 10s. I check, the original raiser bets $5, the next guy raises it to $15, one folds. I call for $15, the original bettor goes all-in for $80, and the raiser (who also had about $80 left) calls immediately. I have about $70 left. I really felt like I was beat, but all I could think of was Harrington's book where he says that people who flop sets and fold (with no straights or flush possibilities on the board) are idiots.Was I supposed to call or fold?

I bolded the key part of the OP. If you were playing 5/5 and two people got all-in for $1600, then you could think about folding a set on the flop. In this kind of a game though, the hand range your up against includes JJ-AA, T8, J9, 97, maybe even T2, 82, and AT. You're going to have to pay this one off; sorry.Again, against a good player, you can use a specific hand range. I was reading Ace on the River the other day, and Barry Greenstein was talking about a tournament where he folded QQ on a board of A-Q-x-x-x for a pot-sized bet on the river because he knew the other guy had AA. In a .25/.25 game however, you'll be surprised how many times you win a pot in this kind of situation.

SHOVE AND SAY A PRAYER!

[milestodavid]

So you're getting better than 2:1 on your money, AND you flopped a set, easy call. If you are in the UNLIKELY situation that one of them has a higher set, you just cant fold this hand, you would make money on this hand more than 90 percent of the time.I had a hand like this one time, but it was a 1-1 NL game. I had 10 10 on the button. UTG raises to $3, MP caller, cut-off min-raises to $5 (I wonder what he has). I was going to call the initial $2, so i figured if i call the other $2 and flop a set, I woulda get paid off huge. Everyone else calls. $20 in the pot.Flop: 4 10 Q . UTG checks. MP bets $10, cut-off goes all-in for $40, I move in over the top for $80, UTG folds, MP calls.Turn: 2 River: 3 MP: Q J Cut-Off: A A I win a $223 dollar pot.So you see, you pay these hands off even if you might be beat, considering an unlikely situation. Of course it's possible to get away from one of these hands, but not online. If it was live, you could get a read, but not in this situation.

[ScottK2001]

What bothered me, though, was that there was a raise all-in and a call all-in in front of me. Turns out the initial raiser had KK and the caller had 8-8 for middle set, and the 8-8 held up.I called, and lost, but I agree that I think calling was the right play.