15 replies to this topic

[ahosang]

Which version do you think offers the best long-term profitability playing in low stake online games? Omaha 8 we know has low variance, while Omaha hi has a higher variance. But what about the long-term results(of course, assume good proficiency in both)?You can give separate answers and reasoning for limit and pot-limit. I don't claim to know the answer, but I'll let you know my thoughts(I'm still considering some things as I wriite).

[koolromeo]

i think omaha 8 is where the money is. people just keep grasping at straws thinking they are going to get half the pot with their inferior holdings. they just keep putting money in the pot drawing practically dead in both directions. even good players do it. very few have the deiscipline to only play quality hands, and when the get a hand they often still put in a usless bet on the flop . i also like the low variances of o8 versus o hi.

[KDawgCometh]

Omaha hi takes a good amount of skill to be goos at, whereas 8 o/b you can get good at pretty fast and dominate your opponents at a faster rate.

[ahosang]

Thanks for the replies so far. I'm pretty good at both, but I've been concentrating on Omaha8 in recent months so I've played very little Hi-only for a while. The reason for the question is that I've been looking at the figures for average pot and players/flop at Party, Betfair, and a few others. I've noticed that both limit and PL Hi are roughly yielding the same average pot at the same stake level. In the case of Party, the Hi-only pots are often slightly bigger. Considering the bad drawing/calling that goes on, and the different natures of the games in terms of hand values, I'm wondering whether the O8 fish are worse than the Hi-only fish or not. On the flop in Hi, you would think most would fold, but if the pots are roughly the same there must be some dreadful drawing going on. Another consideration is the fact that I believe more hold'em players go straight into Omaha-hi rather than O8. Maybe that's the time to make money. O8 players may be a little more educated in general.I'l give O8 a rest for a while and see how the hi-game is being played at the moment.

[KDawgCometh]

from what I've seen on party is that the 8 o/b fish might be a little better than the hi fish, but they really handicap you on the PLO table with just 50 BBs to start.

[Truckasaurus II]

Omaha Hi is better. Money playing Omaha is made off people who come directly from HE and apply those principles directly to Omaha, resulting in the obvious mistakes and errors. Typically, people play Hi because it's less confusing, your average HE player has no feel for a split game and will stay away.

[Smasharoo]

O8 is where the money is if you play it well.O-hi has more variance and less opportunity to push massive edges.

[Aburame Shino]

I like O8 because people keep thinking they have the best Hi or Lo hand when they really don't. Also in my home games people kept forgetting that you must use 2 cards in your hand with 3 on the board, so they kept trying to use 3 cards in their hand for a flush or something. After I beat it into their head with an oar they finally got it. =P

[KKsuited]

I can't really look at any game and say one is more profitable than the other if you take the skill part out (by saying you are good at both).It just depends on who's playing what game at a given time. There are some people that don't fully understand O8 and can lose a lot of money, just like any other game.Honestly, I don't think there can be an answer to this question.

[srharris22]

i have been struggling at this question myself. i too came straight from HE (NL and limit) to expand my horizons. I went straight to O8 limit, did fairly well on 6 handed tables, found i played too many hands for a full ring game, so i just tightened up when i could not get on a 6 handed table. That was great experience before i started to try PL omaha high and now going back to play some PL O8 (due to people like smash that stand by the fact that it is where the money is). I was able to progress from playing many more hands in NL/limit to being much more selective, now i can go up to 1 hour before seeing a hand through to the river in either PL O8 or PL O high on one table. sometimes i feel i am too selective but at current I tend to play 2-3 100 dollar PL Omaha high 10 person tables and just wait for the nuts, with the rare naked ace bluff. And i mean rare. patience is soooo important in this game, the fish will bite the hook eventually even more so than NLHE.

[nopantsdance]

if you are wanting to play low stakes, i would say you should play o/8. just for the same reason you play limit hold'em to nlhe. you get to play more hands from out of position. this is why i think you are wrong for saying you get a higher variance in omaha hi. with omaha/8 you get to play more hands and the pots get a lot bigger. this is why good players play o/8 above any other game. plus, i find it a lot easier to play o/8 online than omaha hi. maybe this is just me, but i can play 3 or 4 omaha/8 tables (on 2 different sites) but i can only play one or two plo tables. i don't play that much online anymore, but if you are variance oriented, you should read a few books on o/8, work on your game, and multi table as much as possible if you are wanting to make a few bucks.

[Smasharoo]

I can't really look at any game and say one is more profitable than the other if you take the skill part out (by saying you are good at both). Sure you can if your opposition plays equally badly.I'll beat a terrible player at chess 50 times out of 50. I'll beat him at holdem 30 times out of 50. I'll beat him at O8 40 times out of 50.Each game has more or less of a *diffreential* between skilled players and unskilled ones. That differential is higher in O8 than in O-hi, and it's higher in O-hi than it is in Holdem.Obviously two equally skilled players playing any game will be evenly matched.

[ahosang]

Smasharoo said:

I'll beat a terrible player at chess 50 times out of 50.  I'll beat him at holdem 30 times out of 50.  I'll beat him at O8 40 times out of 50.Each game has more or less of a *diffreential* between skilled players and unskilled ones.  That differential is higher in O8 than in O-hi, and it's higher in O-hi than it is in Holdem.

Well said.And to follow up, sorry, I didn't spend too much time playing PLO because it's too boring for me. So I didn't really find out, but I'll stick to O8(limit and PL) anyway. One other thing, does anyone play $3/$6 or above online? I had two sessions as practice for the future(my bankroll is $2/$4 at the moment) and one was good, one disastrous.The play was very tight at $3/$6 on Party. I think you have to be more aggressive, playing it almost like mid-limit Hold'em(not that I've ever played mid-limit hold'em). This worked for me in the first session where betting out aggressively caused people to just fold on a raggy flop for a smallish pot. Position also matters more than the lower limits I think, since at the lower limits, you'd bet, call, fold, or raise on the value of your hand(and you'd mostly just play the good hands), but at $3/$6, it was so tight, you could steal blinds sometime with a raise on the button!!The $2/$4 game are looser, not as bad post-flop as $0.50/$1, but beatable due to the looseness and passivity. Anyone got any thoughts on the higher limits?

[ddudley]

Smasharoo said:

I'll beat a terrible player at chess 50 times out of 50. I'll beat him at holdem 30 times out of 50. I'll beat him at O8 40 times out of 50.Each game has more or less of a *diffreential* between skilled players and unskilled ones. That differential is higher in O8 than in O-hi, and it's higher in O-hi than it is in Holdem.Obviously two equally skilled players playing any game will be evenly matched.

So, if I'm reading you right you would give O-hi a 35/50 in the same senario?I'm also trying to decide which of these two games to learn next.

[Absolute]

O8 is the best game to play online hands down. Especially if you don't mind playing at Party Poker. It's a game everyone thinks they know how to play but that most of those people really don't have a clue.I love beating chumps at O8, it's a hobby of mine, up there with frisbee and Spades. :-) But don't be fooled, sitting at a table with a group of people that can play )8 can be very, very frustrating and challenging.

[Briguy]

O8 is amazingly profitable. I'm the first to admit that I'm not good at O8. I make questionable calls and get quartered more than I like. I'm a complete rookie at the game. But it's still profitable for me, more so than limit holdem, because of the low skill of the other players.Last night, I had a bad run at hold'em. I got AA twice; they were cracked each time. I didn't hit a single set, nor even flop a flush draw with my suited aces or connectors. The few OESD's I flopped didn't come through. I kept getting sucked out on by 2-outers, and once even a 1-outer (1-outer to the Royal! That was actually pretty neat to see). I took a few pots here and there, of course, but was down 30 BB over the course of two hours. What did I do? Went over to limit O8 and made it all back in the span of half an hour. I really only got about 10 playable hands, but I pushed the edges and won three big pots. That was all it took to restore my bankroll and allow me to go to bed happy. Hurray for O8!**Please note: results may vary.