21 replies to this topic

[EarWaxEater]

Ok ok..most likely that is not going to happen. I didn't see a legal section so I just posted it here.Personally, I would like to see online gambling made illegal in the United States. I know, the rise in poker recently was made possible in some part to online poker. Online poker has also gave some people a new profession they would not have in the past.But, the revenue generated by these online poker is huge. I believe Party poker stated they made a profit of $340 million last year. A figure I believe is way under reported.The profit theses online poker makes, goes to a few investors. While if the money went to a land casino, many people would share in the money generated...dealers, waitresses, cashiers...valets...etc.Plus, taxes are being missed that could go toward schools and roads.Think about it, the $340 million profit by party poker is going to be shared by half a dozen lucky people. EACH Year!!..anyways, what do you all think?

[allinbluff35]

never going to happen, the united states government would rather figure out a way so they could tax it and gain profit.

[AceOfSpaiDs]

I agree with the dude above, its only a matter of time before the government rubs its greedy hands together and tries to get in on some of the earnings of online poker, but make it illegal....thats dumb, think about all the people who make money that dont work for an online poker site and use the money to help themselves out (for some online poker is a full/part time job, its like a second job to me...helping out with added cash)...so to make it illegal, man, so many people here would also have to get a new hobby, and we wouldn't want that sh!t

[A3DDFAN]

can't we have some freedom in this country to decide what we want to do in the privacy of our own homes.?just a thought

[Mandelbrot]

I don't have a problem with taxing it in order for it to be legal and legitimized. I would gladly pay a little extra to know for certain that my online gambling is legal rather than pay less and not be sure. I think making it illegal would be horrible for poker and would have little positive impact on casinos. In truth, it would probably hurt them b/c less people -- far less -- would probably play poker.

[Wilderness]

Yeah, the biggest reason is that the government would love to tax all that money.Besides, closing down all online poker wouldn't really help the casino's anyway. I think that most people who live nearby a casino and play poker regularly, probably do it live anyway. Its the many, many people (myself included) who live no-where near a casino who would suffer.

[Shaffer]

I don't think you can make that compelling a case that the proliferation of online poker is hurting B&M casinos - I believe I could make a more compelling case that it is helping them by building an interet in poker, helping to remove some of the stigma associated with gambling, etc. Most B&M casinos pull a paltry percentage of their winnings from poker, anyway.Regardless, I don't see how criminalization is a rational response to the emergence of companies that have figured out a very efficient business model. Making laws specifically to target such an industry is just plain stupid. Competition helps the economy.Certainly online poker should be regulated and taxed, and any companies that are guilty of fraud, as you assert (baselessly, I imagine), should be prosecuted. But I see no reason, apart from the potential for moralist tubthumping, that online poker should be made illegal.

[KDawgCometh]

the WTO ruled in the past six months that the US governments stance on online gambling isn't fair trade practices. I like how the org. that we prop up is calling us out on online gambling.

[dms26]

I don't know where you live EarWax but if not for online I'd have only one place to play. There is a casino in Tampa but its straight limit $2 per bet, tahts it. And I could only play hold em, stud or omaha h/l. Plus since I live on the opposite side of Tampa it takes an hour just to get there and the room is always full. It's also on an Indian reservation, so they are making almost all the money. Perosnally I feel I should be able to decide when and where I like to play, if i want to play at 3 am in my boxers I should be able to. It's a joke the way some things are regulated.

[bdluss]

Just one quick point, I noticed a few posters talked about the government making it illegal to gamble online. The governments stance CURRENTLY is that it IS illegal to gamble online. So each time each of us goes and gambles, we are tecnically breaking the law. Just wanted to clarify this point.

[MilesZS]

I was wondering about the above -- Is it actually illegal for 'US' as citizens to gamble online? Or, is it illegal for the online casinos to operate in the U.S.? I think it's the latter. It is obvious that thousands upon thousands of people play online poker, and in fact it is mentioned frequently on TV. There are even TV commercials promoting it. I think we would hear about more people being arrested or whatever for it (never heard of that happening). None of the companies operate from the U.S. though, which I think is the key point.

[Wilderness]

Yeah, I actually think that Miles is correct, that it is illegal to operate an online casino (which is why all these sites are located outside the usa) but not illegal for us to use those sites.

[planoace]

EarWaxEater said:

The profit theses online poker makes, goes to a few investors. While if the money went to a land casino, many people would share in the money generated...dealers, waitresses, cashiers...valets...etc.Plus, taxes are being missed that could go toward schools and roads.Think about it, the $340 million profit by party poker is going to be shared by half a dozen lucky people. EACH Year!!..anyways, what do you all think?

I think you're an economic ignoramous....like most of the liberal persuasion, your view is a gross oversimplification. Online poker stimulates further interest in, and lessens the 'taboo' surrounding, poker specifically and casino gaming in general. More people will find their way to B&M casinos due to their gaining experience playing online. Many online players have no casino in their proximity, and aren't able to travel long distances.The government takes more than enough of my money already - into the pockets of professional politicians and into boondoggles benefiting the bureaucratic establishment. Those starting online sites invest and risked their own money into it, at the risk of losing it if they failed. They aren't "lucky", they are visionary entrepreneurs who put their money where their mouths are. They deserve to reap the rewards - no one forces anyone to play at their sites. Competition will, over time, reduce rakes, so the more quality on-lines sites, the better for the consumer.It's called FREEDOM and FREE ENTERPRISE.....let freedom reign!!!

[sloshr]

Forget about stopping online poker. That will never happen. The government does need to regulate it, however. I was recently robbed at Party, where someone hacked into my account, played and lost most of my money. Party admitted this to me, that they know it was an outsider that played on my account. They apologized, but said it was my fault for having a bad password, and said they are not responsible for the fraud, with a disclaimer that they are governed by the laws of Gibraltar. After I had some industry people talk to them for me, they gave me a "gift" of $300, though more than $600 was stolen from my account. I promptly withdrew the money before they could change their mind. For those of you with large balances at Party, be careful.

[AceyDeucy]

From the Wire act:Whoever being engaged in the business of betting or wagering knowingly uses a wire communication facility for the transmission in interstate or foreign commerce of bets or wagers or information assisting in the placing of bets or wagers on any sporting event or contest, or for the transmission of a wire communication which entitles the recipient to receive money or credit as a result of bets or wagers, or for information assisting in the placing of bets or wagers, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.So, under the wire act, the use of the internet to transmit betting information is illegal, and those companies doing so are commiting a crime. Secondarily, the US views these companies as illegal gambling operations since, among other things, they allowing gambling without licenses in the places they allow people to gamble. (e.g. They are not licensed to run a casino in Philadelphia, but people in Philadelphia can gamble with them) However, as these companies are offshore, they have no legal means to detain and prosecute them. So, laws that cover the "aiding and abetting" of illegal gambling can also be applied to these buisnesses. For instance, when the Travel Channel had a bunch of money seized that one of the online sites had paid them for advertising. While most governmetns would allow gambling because of the significant revenue stream they can get from it, they run into political realities of gambling being very unpopular where people live. Everyone is fine with gambling, as long as it is somewhere else. (NIMBY, Not In My Back Yard) This is why you normally only see casino spring up in extremely poor areas, where they desperately need the jobs and money (which, in combination with some fascinating legal manuvers, led to Indian casinos). In short, the problem is bigger than taxes. Online gambling isn't ilelgal because the government "can't figure out" how to tax. Trust me, the government can ALWAYS figure out a way to tax stuff. And if it doesn't work the first time, they'll try again. The problem is the bad name gambling has in the US, and the resultant politcal obstaclecs. The long and short of it is that online gambling will never be legal in the US, because you will never get enough states to be politcally fine with it. How aggressive the government tries to stamp out online gaming is another matter. Ashcroft really wanted to, for instance. I doubt it will ever be a high enough priority that individual players are in danger, though.

[Bonobio]

One thing being overlooked is that there is no way that any casino will be able to draw 4000 poker players at the same time to their facility, let alone have the space to host them. That's where the real profit margin lies.

[ddudley]

EarWaxEater said:

Personally, I would like to see online gambling made illegal in the United States. I know, the rise in poker recently was made possible in some part to online poker. Online poker has also gave some people a new profession they would not have in the past.

Ya dude, we all think it's a great idea!! That why we are all here in a "Poker Forum" reading this, an "Online Poker Forum" no less. Why would you post that opinion here of all places? Just to start an arguement I'm sure. People like you are a waste of oxygen.You don't even differentiate online Poker from online gambing. It's pretty obvious to me that you are not a poker player and are probably some right wing extremist. Let me be the first to say that you are not welcome here. Go away!! This is a community of poker players who are working to better themselves, our comminuty and the entire poker community. Crap like this doesn't help do any of that. Why don't you go bother someone else?BTW - online poker is here to stay and there's nothing you or the US Federal Goverment can do about it.

EarWaxEater said:

Plus, taxes are being missed that could go toward schools and roads.

How about making B&M Poker and Online Poker legal instead? Then you can tax it all you want.

EarWaxEater said:

Think about it, the $340 million profit by party poker is going to be shared by half a dozen lucky people. EACH Year!!..

They took the risk and put up all the money to start it. Who should get the profit? You? Do you think all successful business people should be punished or just a few? Maybe we should make you king of earth so we can all follow your law, obviously that's the best way and everyone else is just stupid.To sum up - go away, you are bad for our community!!

[ddudley]

planoace said:

I think you're an economic ignoramous....like most of the liberal persuasion, your view is a gross oversimplification.

Calling this guy a liberal is an insult to all liberal minded people everywhere. Most liberals are more intelligent and a lot more tolerent of other people and their views than this idiot. He sounds a lot more like a right wing religious extremist than a liberal.The rest of your post I totally agree with, well said.

[KDawgCometh]

Quote

I think you're an economic ignoramous....like most of the liberal persuasion, your view is a gross oversimplification.

in fact, those of us of the liberal persuasion are for letting people be and do what they feel makes them happy, which playing onine poker would be. Eat dose apples

[Dick Danger]

EarWaxEater said:

Think about it, the $340 million profit by party poker is going to be shared by half a dozen lucky people. EACH Year!!..

Seems like you're just bitter about your station in life.