23 replies to this topic

[jayo]

Playing a 20 euro + rebuys tourney in local casino last night , after end of rebuys and top ups i have just over 12000 in chips, blinds r now 300 and 600. Next hand is dealt i am on the button , first position raises to 2500, i limper i look down at pocket As , i push all in , raiser calls , limper folds , i throw out my Pocket As he turns over big slick , flop K K 4 , turn 7 and river Q i was so sick i cant even remember what suit these cards were . After counting chips i had 100 left in chips just 1 black chip worth a lousy 100.To make a long story short i came back and shared 1st prize , a nice 1150 euro each . How the next 5-6 hands went all in on the blind and kept hitting .As i got to about 6k in chips i tried to wait till i had something.people who were knocked out of the tourney stayed just to see how far i would get , so when there was 2 of us heads up and my opponent decided we should split everyone was saying i shouldnt taht tonight was my lucky night i should go to win , but i felt i shouldnt push it too far .I think though i may have used up my luck for the rest of the year though

[deucedeuce]

I would say it was your lucky night, losing all your chips with AA to AK.

[AndrewBlack]

you got alot luckierthan the guy with ak did. doubling up 6 straight hands is intense. Congrads btw.

[loxo]

jayo said:

Playing a 20 euro + rebuys tourney in local casino last night , after end of rebuys and top ups i have just over 12000 in chips, blinds r now 300 and 600. Next hand is dealt i am on the button , first position raises to 2500, i limper i look down at pocket As , i push all in , raiser calls , limper folds , i throw out my Pocket As he turns over big slick , flop K K 4 , turn 7 and river Q i was so sick i cant even remember what suit these cards were . After counting chips i had 100 left in chips just 1 black chip worth a lousy 100.To make a long story short i came back and shared 1st prize , a nice 1150 euro each . How the next 5-6 hands went all in on the blind and kept hitting .As i got to about 6k in chips i tried to wait till i had something.people who were knocked out of the tourney stayed just to see how far i would get , so when there was 2 of us heads up and my opponent decided we should split everyone was saying i shouldnt taht tonight was my lucky night i should go to win , but i felt i shouldnt push it too far .I think though i may have used up my luck for the rest of the year though

mmmm

[joeltebbutt]

I call shenanigans

[Jelly-Filled Ace]

I have a Poker Gnome. He's +EV.

[Royal_Tour]

jayo said:

Playing a 20 euro + rebuys tourney in local casino last night , after end of rebuys and top ups i have just over 12000 in chips, blinds r now 300 and 600. Next hand is dealt i am on the button , first position raises to 2500, i limper i look down at pocket As , i push all in , raiser calls , limper folds , i throw out my Pocket As he turns over big slick , flop K K 4 , turn 7 and river Q i was so sick i cant even remember what suit these cards were . After counting chips i had 100 left in chips just 1 black chip worth a lousy 100.To make a long story short i came back and shared 1st prize , a nice 1150 euro each . How the next 5-6 hands went all in on the blind and kept hitting .As i got to about 6k in chips i tried to wait till i had something.people who were knocked out of the tourney stayed just to see how far i would get , so when there was 2 of us heads up and my opponent decided we should split everyone was saying i shouldnt taht tonight was my lucky night i should go to win , but i felt i shouldnt push it too far .I think though i may have used up my luck for the rest of the year though

yes., well luck is really the only thing that kept you in to win. I'm not sure your thinking behind coming over the top for 12k with A's

[jayo]

yes., well luck is really the only thing that kept you in to win. I'm not sure your thinking behind coming over the top for 12k with A's[/quote]My thinking here royal was that there was 5900 in the pot b4 it got to me so if one player folded i felt heads up i would have won pot rather than be against 2 players , not saying it was right play but i thought it might be

[Royal_Tour]

jayo]yes., on well luck is really the only thing that kept you in to win. I, said:

My thinking here royal was that there was 5900 in the pot b4 it got to me so if one player folded i felt heads up i would have won pot rather than be against 2 players , not saying it was right play but i thought it might be

maybe it was your wording then.. cuz i was confused how you could have a raise to 2500 then a limper?Did under the gun raise to 2500? i'm just trying to draw the picture in my head, there was 900 in the pot from the blinds, then a limper somewhere, and a 2500 raise?. or a raise of 1900 which made it 2500 to go?where the limper is located is a big part in this hand also. I'm almost tempted to just call in this situation.

[jayo]

Royal_Tour said:

jayo said:

yes., well luck is really the only thing that kept you in to win. I'm not sure your thinking behind coming over the top for 12k with A's

Did under the gun raise to 2500? i'm just trying to draw the picture in my head, there was 900 in the pot from the blinds, then a limper somewhere, and a 2500 raise?. or a raise of 1900 which made it 2500 to go?where the limper is located is a big part in this hand also. I'm almost tempted to just call in this situation.

Sorry royal i knew i was gonna word this wrong , the person after the big blind raised it to 2500 , next player 2 seats b4 me flat called the 2500 , . when i moved all in i was expecting the initial raiser to fold and the person who flat called the raise to call my raise ( i felt he was trying to slow play big cards , which i was wrong . sorry for the confusion

[Royal_Tour]

jayo said:

Royal_Tour said:

jayo said:

yes., well luck is really the only thing that kept you in to win. I'm not sure your thinking behind coming over the top for 12k with A's

Did under the gun raise to 2500? i'm just trying to draw the picture in my head, there was 900 in the pot from the blinds, then a limper somewhere, and a 2500 raise?. or a raise of 1900 which made it 2500 to go?where the limper is located is a big part in this hand also. I'm almost tempted to just call in this situation.

Sorry royal i knew i was gonna word this wrong , the person after the big blind raised it to 2500 , next player 2 seats b4 me flat called the 2500 , . when i moved all in i was expecting the initial raiser to fold and the person who flat called the raise to call my raise ( i felt he was trying to slow play big cards , which i was wrong . sorry for the confusion

Ok.. makes a lot more sense.I understand why you pushed, there was a decent sized pot in there and you only had 12k left. depending on what the other 2 players had for chip stacks. I might have been inclined to throw a raise rather than a push.Simple logic behind it would be, Your aces are always waaay ahead. (which they were) a raise to 5k would leave you with 7k, which shows your pot commited and thus making their decision to call you, fairly tuff. either : A - you get 1 or 2 calls, B - you get 2 folds, C - you get a over the top re-raise, All of these situations are Ok. if you get 1 or 2 calls, and flop looks safe, then you push. If you get 2 folds, well its ok cuz you just won 5900.00 from the pot, (show your aces, to say, "i'm not messing around boys")and if you get a over the top. well its an automatic call. And hope for the best.The only reason i like the raise rather then push is because you probably wont scare them out. and in the case we saw with you, if the flop is K,K 5 etc.. you can proceed with caution on this. the 1st raiser would very likely check this flop. why bet out if none of you hold a K., which gives you a free turn card. I know. throwing A's is hard/ but sometimes you have to do it.have you read Harrington on Holdem? volume 2 is perfect. great book. .get it

[Royal_Tour]

sorry , just to add. without the chip stacks of the other players its hard for me to judge if they would call or fold to your push.If you think they will auto call.. then ok.. but this push could have easily pushed them out of the hand. and its better to extract more money from someone who only gets to see three cards (the flop) rather then all five.What i mean here is his "suckout" odds increase with 5 cards, flop , turn , river.. so dont let him see those 5 cards. post flop skill is key.you want to be all in as little as possible in tourneys

[jayo]

[quote name='"Royal_Tour"][quote name='"jayo"][quote=Royal_Tour][quote=jayo]yes.' date=' well luck is really the only thing that kept you in to win. I'm not sure your thinking behind coming over the top for 12k with A's[/quote']Simple logic behind it would be' date=' Your aces are always waaay ahead. (which they were) a raise to 5k would leave you with 7k, which shows your pot commited and thus making their decision to call you, fairly tuff. either : A - you get 1 or 2 calls, B - you get 2 folds, C - you get a over the top re-raise, All of these situations are Ok. if you get 1 or 2 calls, and flop looks safe, then you push. If you get 2 folds, well its ok cuz you just won 5900.00 from the pot, (show your aces, to say, "i'm not messing around boys")and if you get a over the top. well its an automatic call. And hope for the best.The only reason i like the raise rather then push is because you probably wont scare them out. and in the case we saw with you, if the flop is K,K 5 etc.. you can proceed with caution on this. the 1st raiser would very likely check this flop. why bet out if none of you hold a K., which gives you a free turn card. I know. throwing A's is hard/ but sometimes you have to do it.have you read Harrington on Holdem? volume 2 is perfect. great book. .get it[/quote']Cheers royal , havnt read the book but genuinely thanks for the advice , this is only my second post here , i read a lot of what people write here but i have also seen the amount of abuse some people give them afterwards as well so it was nice to see your responce . what you said makes a lot more sence alright compared to the way i played it , i would never have thought of playing that way . well lets hope it comes with experience ( and cheaply ) thnaks again

[Whiskey16]

Royal_Tour said:

sorry , just to add. without the chip stacks of the other players its hard for me to judge if they would call or fold to your push.If you think they will auto call.. then ok.. but this push could have easily pushed them out of the hand. and its better to extract more money from someone who only gets to see three cards (the flop) rather then all five.What i mean here is his "suckout" odds increase with 5 cards, flop , turn , river.. so dont let him see those 5 cards. post flop skill is key.you want to be all in as little as possible in tourneys

Understand that you don't know chip stacks which is important, but based on the fact that OP was left with 1 black chip, we know he was about even with UTG, and not sure about limper.How much would you re-raise there? A minimum raise commits nearly 1/2 the OPs stack, but probably does't isolate either UTG or limper. I know AA is waaaay ahead as you say, but I'd rather play it against one other player.OP what was average chip stack at the time?Royal, I do see what you're saying about being all in as little as possible, and extracting money for what is likely the best hand, but I think I'd rather push here and win the 6K in the pot, and improve my stack by 50%, than risk dumping 1/2 my stack on a bad beat, even though that's what proved to happen here.

[Royal_Tour]

Whiskey16 said:

Royal_Tour said:

sorry , just to add. without the chip stacks of the other players its hard for me to judge if they would call or fold to your push.If you think they will auto call.. then ok.. but this push could have easily pushed them out of the hand. and its better to extract more money from someone who only gets to see three cards (the flop) rather then all five.What i mean here is his "suckout" odds increase with 5 cards, flop , turn , river.. so dont let him see those 5 cards. post flop skill is key.you want to be all in as little as possible in tourneys

Understand that you don't know chip stacks which is important, but based on the fact that OP was left with 1 black chip, we know he was about even with UTG, and not sure about limper.How much would you re-raise there? A minimum raise commits nearly 1/2 the OPs stack, but probably does't isolate either UTG or limper. I know AA is waaaay ahead as you say, but I'd rather play it against one other player.OP what was average chip stack at the time?Royal, I do see what you're saying about being all in as little as possible, and extracting money for what is likely the best hand, but I think I'd rather push here and win the 6K in the pot, and improve my stack by 50%, than risk dumping 1/2 my stack on a bad beat, even though that's what proved to happen here.

remember, blinds are only 300/600 he had 20x the BB in a online MTT this is usually just under average stack size. (depending on type of tourney and site)A push and a raise would work the same in this situation, You are only getting called by people with strong hands, which are dominated anyways. A raise to 5k does take a nice chunk off his stack, but he still has over 11.5X BB, which we all know is short stacked. But still easily workable.The re-raise also lets A,K and A,Q and whoever else is dumb enough to play, come into the mix. Your odds that you will be outdrawn on the flop are slim, but over the 5 community cards, flop , turn, river, those odds increase. which is why i love river suck outs.If he isnt able to play this hand post flop from position with a raise, and a call. then Uh oh.. your in trouble

[Royal_Tour]

sorry whiskey.does my post make more sense if the the community cards were 10,6,2,K,Kthese are the same odds of turning over K,K,10,6,2 as five random cards.but you can cut those odds down, if the flop is 10,6,2. and you push all in. see what i mean

[potpumper43]

Easy all in push correct play, there was too much already out there as he stated a 50% increase in his stack makes this an easy decision. Any smaller raise and he's giving them a nice price, and committing himself anyway w/ half his chips already in pot holding AA. Mise well put the commitment on them instead.

[Royal_Tour]

potpumper43 said:

Easy all in push correct play, there was too much already out there as he stated a 50% increase in his stack makes this an easy decision. Any smaller raise and he's giving them a nice price, and committing himself anyway w/ half his chips already in pot holding AA. Mise well put the commitment on them instead.

No. he was playing a live local casino. Not playing online. He needs to build his stack here since he is sitin in a great spot to do so. he has 5k less. push and double up. Right now he is in a spot where he can make a raise and extract more money from this hand.we still dont know the chip stack of the other players, so we dont know if a push would scare them out, or if they were priced to call.You're going on the "get your chips in with the best hand" theory, how about "get their chips when you have the best hand"

[DCSports92GSR]

royal.... I think my av > yours. oh wait, yep...it is

[Whiskey16]

Royal_Tour said:

sorry whiskey.does my post make more sense if the the community cards were 10,6,2,K,Kthese are the same odds of turning over K,K,10,6,2 as five random cards.but you can cut those odds down, if the flop is 10,6,2. and you push all in. see what i mean

Valid point.