24 replies to this topic

[Kris Kringle]

...i rarely raise with AK, except sometimes in late postion as a way to mix up my game...but i'm thinking, should i raise LESS often when the AK is suited???...i figure that if your desired suit DOES come, then you would probably want more people in the pot, as opposed to less......btw, the other reason i generally don't raise with AK is because i prefer to see a flop with it, and without raising pre-flop you're then much more likely to have someone betting into you, should an ace or king come out...then you can raise the initial bettor anyway...

[Wilderness]

You should almost always raise with AK, suited or not. Its a good hand, although not a made one, and so you should usually be raising to get the maximum value of it. Sure, you won't always be hitting an A or a K, but playing scared is a losing strategy. Besides, what about all those times you limp in with it, spike an A or a K, then lose to the 2 pair of 6's and 3's that you let one of the blinds see the flop with? You need to be raising/re-raising with this hand most of the time when you get it. There are always situations where you would only want to limp/call/fold, but that's not the majority of the time.

[Eskimo]

Kris Kringle said:

...i rarely raise with AK

Thats not good, you should always raise with AK, suited or not.

[Kris Kringle]

...one of the main reasons i don't like raising with AK is because you pretty much have to continue betting it, even if you miss the flop...at least, if everyone checks around to you...otherwise you're pretty much announcing your hand...it's just personal preference...i used to raise with AK damn near every time, when i first started playing...but i've found i have more success just seing a flop with it...then if you miss the flop and someone bets into you, it's pretty easy to lay it down (especially if they have callers)...but mainly, my question was about raising with AK suited as opposed to AK off-suit...if you can draw to a nut flush (especially if there's an A or K on the board), i would think you'd want as much action as you can get...the only drawback i see is that with more people in the pot, you're more likely to have to call a raise, making your draw more expensive...

[Pearl]

not raising with AK (on or off suit) = not so good poker? many many reasons why its the case, and especially from mid to late position (IMHO). and to mix up the play on AK, i personally might just call from early positions, and if there is a reraise, then i might reraise all in. often you will get a fold in NL. also if you dont raise, and flop comes A, 2,2, what do you do? you have no idea if someone sees it cheap from blind with 7 2 off.

[wrto4556]

Pearl said:

not raising with AK (on or off suit) = not so good poker? many many reasons why its the case, and especially from mid to late position (IMHO). and to mix up the play on AK, i personally might just call from early positions, and if there is a reraise, then i might reraise all in. often you will get a fold in NL. also if you dont raise, and flop comes A, 2,2, what do you do? you have no idea if someone sees it cheap from blind with 7 2 off.

That's one reason you raise.another: AK does best heads-up. You want to raise to eliminate the field.Heres another: AK will win enough of the time to make a raise profitable. If you have limpers you should raise. You will get alot of hands that can draw out on you to fold. If they do call and decide to draw against your AK, you will win more times than they will, and make a profit from that call.Raise AK! It's true to switch up your play, but you don't do that very often. It only works as planned 1/10 times. So, 90% you should raise AK, suited or not.

[Smasharoo]

Get the extra bet from the people limping in with 89o, j3s, and 22 before the flop where even most horrible players will FOLD if they don't hit the flop somehow.No one says you have to bet AK if it's checked to you and miss the flop multiway. Don't confuse a mistake you make postflop with the correct pre-flop play being flawed."Switching up your play" is completely ****ing pointless unless you're playing against good observant opponents who will beable to exploit your predictability.If that's the case, find a new table, don't worry about playing AK soft before the flop.Still raise it, and still THREE BET with it.

[Pearl]

agree with most of what smash stated, except the part on 'switching up play is pointless'. usually there are at least (and i say at least) one or two at the table (at least tables at the stakes i play) who know what they are doing, and those guys will totally outplay you the moment they can put you on a hand.

[Smasharoo]

usually there are at least (and i say at least) one or two at the table (at least tables at the stakes i play) who know what they are doing, and those guys will totally outplay you the moment they can put you on a hand.Right, they'll know alot when you raise wtih AK and AKs the one time in 80 or whatever you're dealt them. They'll know right away that you're not holding TT or JJ or QQ or AQ or KK or AA or KQs or AJs...Really, don't worry about switching up your play pre-flop. It's really, completely, utterly pointless unless you play with the same 9 guys for months.

[Pearl]

or play at the same club/casino year in year out.have you ever played with marcel luske?

[Smasharoo]

or play at the same club/casino year in year out.have you ever played with marcel luske?Huh?What does Marcel Luske have to do with anythng?

[Pearl]

he can read you like a book in an hour's play. so if you dont change up, you pay for it. so wondering if you have played with him.

[bluff2much]

What about in a low limit game. Or a game thats loose agressive and you have to show down the best hand. I don't think its is simple as how to play A,k. I think you have A,k in early/late position? How do you play it in a passive or agressive game? Limit or No limit? I do believe mixing up the game pre flop is a good idea. If your on the button or blinds, a raise isn't going to get anyone...for the most part. Perhaps you can raise on the flop w/ position....provided that the flop isn't to scary. I was playing today in a low limit game, I got A, k on the button. I caught my A on the flop. No flush draw. I raised on the flop and bet it out the rest of the way, everything worked out ok. But in that game...I had to show down the best hand every time....until It became short handed.....so i didn't feel comfortable raising before the flop, just because I knew that a stupid 2 pair beats me.Jason

[Smasharoo]

he can read you like a book in an hour's play. so if you dont change up, you pay for it. so wondering if you have played with him.That's utter BS, prompted, I assume from him calling that someone had KK when he folded pre-flop on TV. Watch it again and notice him say "Or queens." Marcel or anyone else can't tell if the same sized raise PF is AK or AQ or AA or JJ.Fool.

[Wlleiotl]

Pearl said:

or play at the same club/casino year in year out.have you ever played with marcel luske?

i have, and what you're saying is complete rubbish

[KenP]

I love all those absolute answers. And, I am sure Daniel would love you even more.Hell, TJ talks about limping AA and gives valid reasons for such a decision. There are no absolutes in poker. What is the best hand in the world? T2o--it won two WSOPs in a row.

[Wlleiotl]

always raising is preferable to always limping though, and what you earn by limping is unlikely to be any more than what you gain from raising anyway

[Pearl]

Smasharoo said:

Marcel or anyone else can't tell if the same sized raise PF is AK or AQ or AA or JJ.Fool.

you are one hell of a guy who call people names and put people down without having good arguments. you certainly didn't go to a college in boston. just because YOU can't tell the same sized raise PF, you ASSume others can't. come to new york. you do seem like a halfway decent limit poker player from your posts. i want to invite you to our home game - that is, if you can afford it. i don't play your small stakes $300-500 behind games. you either had a very bad childhood or pretty messed up family. you are always angry or calling people names. one thing - its not your fault..let it go.

[Wlleiotl]

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you either had a very bad childhood or pretty messed up family. you are always angry or calling people names. one thing - its not your fault..let it go.

eh, if you're going to say that i think hes entitled to call you what he wantsand anyway, hes right. are you saying that marcel luske or anyone can tell insteantly what cards you have because you raised the same amount you always do? well he cant. that KK episode in the WSOP was simply deduction, the guy was tight, he reraised marcel not all in but enough to hope marcel would call so the guy had AA or KK and marcel had a A so he said KK. theres probably loads of ESPN tapes with marcel and other players making incorrect reads, but why show them? show the ones where hes right and suddenly morons think he can see into your soul.

[Pearl]

Wlleiotl said:

Quote

you either had a very bad childhood or pretty messed up family. you are always angry or calling people names. one thing - its not your fault..let it go.

eh, if you're going to say that i think hes entitled to call you what he wantsand anyway, hes right. are you saying that marcel luske or anyone can tell insteantly what cards you have because you raised the same amount you always do? well he cant. that KK episode in the WSOP was simply deduction, the guy was tight, he reraised marcel not all in but enough to hope marcel would call so the guy had AA or KK and marcel had a A so he said KK. theres probably loads of ESPN tapes with marcel and other players making incorrect reads, but why show them? show the ones where hes right and suddenly morons think he can see into your soul.

a little circular logic + i still didn't call him names. he started it. by the way, did he pay you ? or is he married to your sister?no comment on second paragraph. i won't even bother arguing because you wont' get it. it would be worse than trying to explain general relativity theory to morons.