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Few Hands From My Session


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#21 akashenk

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 06:48 AM

View Postfighter, on 29 July 2012 - 01:37 AM, said:

Can we all just agree that Stupidhead's name would have been better if he had some numbers in it. Like 5tup1dh3ad.
it would certainly be a stronger password.

#22 answer20

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 07:49 AM

Sorry Ank ... thought we could get some discussion going, but all I did was bring the side show down the hall.

#23 akashenk

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 07:57 AM

View Postanswer20, on 29 July 2012 - 07:49 AM, said:

Sorry Ank ... thought we could get some discussion going, but all I did was bring the side show down the hall.
that's alright. As you can see I'm perfectly willing to mix it up. As for the hands which initiated this thread, I would be interesting to find out what the villain had in the three situations. On the face of it, it looks like our hero ran into some bad spots where a fairly solid/straightforward player either coolered him our just got really lucky. However, I can't help but get the feeling that the villain may have been up to no good in the first couple hands. That min-raise on the turn for half my stack when the board pairs is a play I have used as stone cold bluff in the past. Whether or not it is a good play is up for debate, but I'll tell you it has worked because it looks so much like I am super strong here. Anyhow, like I said my cash-game instincts aren't what they used to be for lack of practice.

#24 TrueAce13

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 09:37 AM

View PostStupidhead, on 28 July 2012 - 11:02 PM, said:

Met donk4life in Vegas. Nice guy. Good at poker. Fish at PLO.Same for Trueace except I can't comment on his PLO skills.
I own PLO babe.you know that! Oh, answer, I'm actually gonna read the hand and try to figure what the best plays are. And I would have to say, I haven't played too much cash, so there are prolly others that are better to take advice from
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#25 TrueAce13

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 09:48 AM

Alright, I'm gonna go a different direction w hand one. I'm either opening or folding pre. In live cash villains are usually loose passive. We can open a large range, and be able to take down a lot of pots w cbets. As well with that, we balance ouir entire range to air and made hands when we open a lot and it keeps our villains guessing. If we don't open, i think this is just a fold pre flop. After that, I agree w everyone else saying that we need to raise more on the flop. As played, I think it might be a fold, but kinda tough. Hard for villain to have a set since we have blockers, it just looks sooooooooo strong. Hand two I think I check back to turn. Cash players, is that a bad thing to do? I think there are only a small range of hands that are calling a bet here and we are gonna but ourselves in some really silly spots if villain does c/r here. I also think we can get some value on the river. Hand three is silly, we are always behind here, but I think we are getting the right price....so meh, I dunno there
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#26 Stupidhead

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 11:11 AM

View PostTrueAce13, on 29 July 2012 - 09:48 AM, said:

Alright, I'm gonna go a different direction w hand one. I'm either opening or folding pre. In live cash villains are usually loose passive. We can open a large range, and be able to take down a lot of pots w cbets. As well with that, we balance ouir entire range to air and made hands when we open a lot and it keeps our villains guessing. If we don't open, i think this is just a fold pre flop. After that, I agree w everyone else saying that we need to raise more on the flop. As played, I think it might be a fold, but kinda tough. Hard for villain to have a set since we have blockers, it just looks sooooooooo strong.Hand two I think I check back to turn. Cash players, is that a bad thing to do? I think there are only a small range of hands that are calling a bet here and we are gonna but ourselves in some really silly spots if villain does c/r here. I also think we can get some value on the river.Hand three is silly, we are always behind here, but I think we are getting the right price....so meh, I dunno there
Hand 1: If we weren't the first one to limp I think limping is fine as is folding. I don't like raising since in most cases we're going to be in a multiway pot. And unless we hit 2 pair+ or a big draw, it's going to be hard to win the pot. Range balancing is never an issue in a 1/2 game so I wouldn't worry about trying to work weaker hands into your raising range.Post flop depends on the reads we have on the SB and BB. Against guys that I know won't fold Kx here it's a snap raise once the BB makes it $15 (like everyone has said, make it around 45). But there's also a bunch of nitty players that I'd probably just flat against. Only person who would have enough information to determine that is the OP. Once we get 4bet by the SB I think it's a pretty easy fold. Nobody ever 4bet bluffs and even a maniac has to be a bit uneasy when he gets raised by 2 players. Hand 2: I wanted to bet since we have the best hand soooo often here, but because I don't think we're getting 2 more streets of value from anything, checking and evaluating river is better. If it checks to us we have a super easy bet, and if he bets we can decide. That's another spot where I can find myself calling some and folding some depending on the player. Against this guy I might be tempted to fold if he bets big but if he bets in the 40-70 range I probably don't find a fold.Facing the check/raise I fold pretty happily. Board is really dry and who expects anyone to fold JX or better here?Hand 3: I don't hate the squeeze but given how well our hand plays multiway I like flatting a lot more. Pot will be large enough that when we flop top pair or a draw we can just shovel money in very happily, whereas if we get called and we whiff, we're going to be in a bunch of bad spots. As for facing the jam it's a super easy call. He can show us 2 Kings or AK and we're still getting the right price with nearly 4:1 on our money.

#27 TrueAce13

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 04:50 PM

lol at you ak tho. when we have been respectful and tried to tell you why your thought process was (still is wrong), you continuously stated why you were soooo correct
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#28 akashenk

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 05:22 PM

View PostTrueAce13, on 29 July 2012 - 04:50 PM, said:

lol at you ak tho. when we have been respectful and tried to tell you why your thought process was (still is wrong), you continuously stated why you were soooo correct
talk about lol. When you respectfully tell me I'm wrong and I respectfully disagree and then you start acting like an ass, that is something to be commended? Way to go, you managed to not be an ass for maybe one post. Good job you.

#29 Ank

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:12 PM

Sorry about the late reply guys been super busy with stuff.Theres been alot of comments about my bet sizing, and this is a topic that id love to get some feed back on even in real life alot of my poker friends say my bet sizing is too small in cash games and tournaments.The reason for my bet sizing is due to being under rolled.Over the last probably 15 months ive had to use my bank roll on real life stuff and busted my roll about 4-5 times due to it and i have to say it gets pretty frustrating rebuilding your roll over and over again even more annoying when you don't bust your roll on poker. So i had to get use to grinding with 5 buy ins or less at times. (I know alot of people have told me to drop down in limits and play online ive tried and i have struggled alot online so i basically stopped untill ive read and studied it abit more)I have develoepd this strategy of playing small ball in cash games to reduce variance as much as possible and ive found it to be proven pretty successful.. yes i could bet $10 pre instead of $8 (my standard raise pre is $5-$8 against the tables $10-$16) or re-raise to $50+ instead of $30.. but by not re-raising to $50+ or $10 i save my self money but still again the same information.Yes i lose out on some value when i collect the small pots but by doing this my percentage of small pots collected (pots <$25) has gone up significantly so i feel that the extra small pots i collect neglects the value i lose from raising a bigger size. Ive found that in a 1/2 live game people don't really care about the small pots and are happy to lose the $5-$6 they have invested in the pot if they flop air (which is a significant amount of the time) howeveer if i raised to the standard amount id have bet bigger and bet more streaks to take down the same pots not to mention with bigger pots players tend to call down more which isnt good if you have air. In a typical 1/2 game i usually buy in for 50 buy ins ($100) and grind it up by taking down alot of small pots and am happy to do this as it reduces variance which also intern protects my bank roll abit more. The reason i don't drop down in limits is because this is the lowest limit i can play in a live cash games and am not successful online and i don't have the patience (something am still working on) to grind low buy in tournments.I feel this is the best way to do things for me especially being under rolled i think reducing variance and protecting my bank roll is more important then maximizing value and playing standard poker. like i said id love to get some feed back on this so please post your thoughts id love to hear em.Back to the hands i've posted;Hand 1: Hero: 4c 5c UTG + 2- 5 players to the flop in a limped pot (pot $10)- Flop: Kc 4s 5d- SB (stack $160) bets $5, BB (Stack $530) Re-Raises $15, Hero (stack $470) 3-Bets to $30, Cut-off and Button Folds, SB 4-Bets $97, BB Folds, Action on Hero. The reason i 3-bet was to isolate the BB who was abit of a maniac and was more of a value raise then anythnig hands like 2 3 and 6 7 is never folding to a bigger raise on this paticular table and also a small raise the BB is calling with almost all of his K range hands here to evaluate on the turn at the time i felt like he didnt have much a kicker with his K and had K <9, and was never betting the turn if he got called on several spots and same with the rivier. I felt by taking this line i can extract the maximum value by losing the minimum amount while gaining the same information. What i didnt account for was the big 4 bet from the SB. By 4-beting the villian polarizses his range so much and i came to the conclusion he had to have minimum K 4 in this spot to make such a move.I ended up folding. I spoke him later on in the session apparently he had K 5 for top two pair and asked him why the big 4-bet his response was that he thought i had smaller two pair was never folding and that he felt the bb was on a open ender and wanted him out of the pot.Hand 2: Hero (Stack $510): Qh Qd UTG +2Pre-Flop: Hero opens for $8, Folds around to SB, SB (Stack $230) Re raises to $23, BB Folds, Hero FlatsFlop: Jd 3c 5h (pot $48)- SB bets $34, Hero Flats.Turn: 3d (pot $116)- SB Checks, Hero bets $45, SB Check Raises to $93, Action on Hero. This was a really weird hand for me in that i didnt take the line i was planning take with this hand, pre flop i felt like he was pretty strong just by his body language and how he raised me, i thought he definately had KK or AA and flated to set mine, on the flop i almost folded to his c-bet, his heart rate increased and if you were on the table you can see that he was breathing abit heavier which usually indicates a big hand, but i choose to flat to evaluate on the turn but i was kinda discusted at my call at this point because i called and i really had no reasoning behind it and i was sure he had KK or AA.On the turn he Checked, and i thought to my self could i be wrong with my read.. and was planning to Check-call the river or check-check and go to a cheap show down.. but i choose to bet the turn to take it down, at this point i still felt he was strong but couldnt work out why he checked the turn also felt that he was going to value bet the river and id have to call so by betting the turn i thought i get to a show down at a cheap price (given villian checking most rivers). If he folded to the bet i would of been happy if he played back i knew where i stood and if he flated i see a show down at a discounted price. Thats why i felt this line was the best to take on the turn. After he min re-raises i was sure i was beat and i made the fold after a few thoughts.. but still couldnt work out why he would take this line if he had KK or AA.Again i spoke to him later in the session about the hand and he told me he had AA and i asked him why the such strange line and apparently he put me on a float.. floating with hands like K Q or even AK/AQ type hands and felt i was never betting the river so he choose to value raise. but i would of thought flatting would of been the better option to see if he barrels the river if that was the case.Hand 3: Hero (Stack $380) : As Qs SBPre-flop: Limped around to UTG + 3, UTG + 3 Raises to $14, Cut-off Calls, Button Calls, Hero Re-Raises to $46, UTG Shoves for $100, Folds around to Hero, Action on Hero.Pot:$94 well I made the call, and i felt like i was getting the right price and what not but after the hand was over a old guy (TAG reg) turns to me and said why did you call i responded by saying i was priced in.. and he said theres no such thing as being priced in if you know he has AA. The reason i posted this hand which basically plays it self after the 3-bet is to find out if anyone else agreed with him.. should i of saved the $54 knowing he had AA or KK?.. anyway he ended up having AA and the board bricked out and i lost the pot. The reason i 3-bet pre was to isolate the pre-flop raiser and the button the CO was a fishy player who was hesitant in calling the orginal raise and felt he was going to fold, at the time the table was very talkative and very passive and i felt i could 3-bet here and take the pot down with a c-bet on the flop. I usually don't 3-bet pre in this spot but i was purely playing the scinario at the time.. i also think here i could of bet abit bigger pre for that plan to work out.Thanks everyone for there feed back much appreciated keep em coming :club:~Ank~

#30 akashenk

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 05:46 AM

View PostAnk, on 01 August 2012 - 06:12 PM, said:

Sorry about the late reply guys been super busy with stuff.Theres been alot of comments about my bet sizing, and this is a topic that id love to get some feed back on even in real life alot of my poker friends say my bet sizing is too small in cash games and tournaments.The reason for my bet sizing is due to being under rolled.Over the last probably 15 months ive had to use my bank roll on real life stuff and busted my roll about 4-5 times due to it and i have to say it gets pretty frustrating rebuilding your roll over and over again even more annoying when you don't bust your roll on poker. So i had to get use to grinding with 5 buy ins or less at times. (I know alot of people have told me to drop down in limits and play online ive tried and i have struggled alot online so i basically stopped untill ive read and studied it abit more)I have develoepd this strategy of playing small ball in cash games to reduce variance as much as possible and ive found it to be proven pretty successful.. yes i could bet $10 pre instead of $8 (my standard raise pre is $5-$8 against the tables $10-$16) or re-raise to $50+ instead of $30.. but by not re-raising to $50+ or $10 i save my self money but still again the same information.Yes i lose out on some value when i collect the small pots but by doing this my percentage of small pots collected (pots <$25) has gone up significantly so i feel that the extra small pots i collect neglects the value i lose from raising a bigger size. Ive found that in a 1/2 live game people don't really care about the small pots and are happy to lose the $5-$6 they have invested in the pot if they flop air (which is a significant amount of the time) howeveer if i raised to the standard amount id have bet bigger and bet more streaks to take down the same pots not to mention with bigger pots players tend to call down more which isnt good if you have air. In a typical 1/2 game i usually buy in for 50 buy ins ($100) and grind it up by taking down alot of small pots and am happy to do this as it reduces variance which also intern protects my bank roll abit more. The reason i don't drop down in limits is because this is the lowest limit i can play in a live cash games and am not successful online and i don't have the patience (something am still working on) to grind low buy in tournments.I feel this is the best way to do things for me especially being under rolled i think reducing variance and protecting my bank roll is more important then maximizing value and playing standard poker. like i said id love to get some feed back on this so please post your thoughts id love to hear em.Back to the hands i've posted;Hand 1: Hero: 4c 5c UTG + 2- 5 players to the flop in a limped pot (pot $10)- Flop: Kc 4s 5d- SB (stack $160) bets $5, BB (Stack $530) Re-Raises $15, Hero (stack $470) 3-Bets to $30, Cut-off and Button Folds, SB 4-Bets $97, BB Folds, Action on Hero.The reason i 3-bet was to isolate the BB who was abit of a maniac and was more of a value raise then anythnig hands like 2 3 and 6 7 is never folding to a bigger raise on this paticular table and also a small raise the BB is calling with almost all of his K range hands here to evaluate on the turn at the time i felt like he didnt have much a kicker with his K and had K <9, and was never betting the turn if he got called on several spots and same with the rivier. I felt by taking this line i can extract the maximum value by losing the minimum amount while gaining the same information. What i didnt account for was the big 4 bet from the SB. By 4-beting the villian polarizses his range so much and i came to the conclusion he had to have minimum K 4 in this spot to make such a move.I ended up folding. I spoke him later on in the session apparently he had K 5 for top two pair and asked him why the big 4-bet his response was that he thought i had smaller two pair was never folding and that he felt the bb was on a open ender and wanted him out of the pot.Hand 2: Hero (Stack $510): Qh Qd UTG +2Pre-Flop: Hero opens for $8, Folds around to SB, SB (Stack $230) Re raises to $23, BB Folds, Hero FlatsFlop: Jd 3c 5h (pot $48)- SB bets $34, Hero Flats.Turn: 3d (pot $116)- SB Checks, Hero bets $45, SB Check Raises to $93, Action on Hero.This was a really weird hand for me in that i didnt take the line i was planning take with this hand, pre flop i felt like he was pretty strong just by his body language and how he raised me, i thought he definately had KK or AA and flated to set mine, on the flop i almost folded to his c-bet, his heart rate increased and if you were on the table you can see that he was breathing abit heavier which usually indicates a big hand, but i choose to flat to evaluate on the turn but i was kinda discusted at my call at this point because i called and i really had no reasoning behind it and i was sure he had KK or AA.On the turn he Checked, and i thought to my self could i be wrong with my read.. and was planning to Check-call the river or check-check and go to a cheap show down.. but i choose to bet the turn to take it down, at this point i still felt he was strong but couldnt work out why he checked the turn also felt that he was going to value bet the river and id have to call so by betting the turn i thought i get to a show down at a cheap price (given villian checking most rivers). If he folded to the bet i would of been happy if he played back i knew where i stood and if he flated i see a show down at a discounted price. Thats why i felt this line was the best to take on the turn. After he min re-raises i was sure i was beat and i made the fold after a few thoughts.. but still couldnt work out why he would take this line if he had KK or AA.Again i spoke to him later in the session about the hand and he told me he had AA and i asked him why the such strange line and apparently he put me on a float.. floating with hands like K Q or even AK/AQ type hands and felt i was never betting the river so he choose to value raise. but i would of thought flatting would of been the better option to see if he barrels the river if that was the case.Hand 3: Hero (Stack $380) : As Qs SBPre-flop: Limped around to UTG + 3, UTG + 3 Raises to $14, Cut-off Calls, Button Calls, Hero Re-Raises to $46, UTG Shoves for $100, Folds around to Hero, Action on Hero.Pot:$94well I made the call, and i felt like i was getting the right price and what not but after the hand was over a old guy (TAG reg) turns to me and said why did you call i responded by saying i was priced in.. and he said theres no such thing as being priced in if you know he has AA. The reason i posted this hand which basically plays it self after the 3-bet is to find out if anyone else agreed with him.. should i of saved the $54 knowing he had AA or KK?.. anyway he ended up having AA and the board bricked out and i lost the pot. The reason i 3-bet pre was to isolate the pre-flop raiser and the button the CO was a fishy player who was hesitant in calling the orginal raise and felt he was going to fold, at the time the table was very talkative and very passive and i felt i could 3-bet here and take the pot down with a c-bet on the flop. I usually don't 3-bet pre in this spot but i was purely playing the scinario at the time.. i also think here i could of bet abit bigger pre for that plan to work out.Thanks everyone for there feed back much appreciated keep em coming :club:~Ank~
Re Hand 3: after the UTG guy shoves I believe the pot is 194, so you're getting about 3.6 to 1 to call. Normally, this is sufficient to call since you are no more than about a 2-1 dog against most starting hands. However, in this particular case, your opponent had AA, which made you about a 7-1 dog, So the pot odds weren't justified for the call. However, you don't KNOW he has AA, as he would likely do the same with KK or even AKs. And in general, there are plenty of players who like to isolate and flip with lots of other starting pairs or hands like AQ (though perhaps not the rock opponent in this hand).Now, if you pretty much think you know he has AA, then fold is the better +EV play, but then you have to think about how this affects your image, etc. I don't know, I've seen worse calls.As for your opponent's comments, I'm not sure if he was suggesting you were a lot further behind than you thought, or ihe he believed that you should always fold when you think your opponent has AA no matter what odds the pot is laying you. If the former, then he was right and the call was pretty loose. If the latter, then I think 99.9% of poker players would disagree. When all there is to consider is starting hand v. starting hand, then in cash games there's always a price point at which it is appropriate to call from behind, even if you know you're going against AA.As for how you played the hand in retrospect, as I said in my original comments, I think you probably needed to 3-bet a little more to guarantee an isolation against the original raiser and you need to be concerned about their stack size and how they play to make sure you weren't all of a sudden going to be facing a 4-bet shove from them. The other thing to consider is, if they are are a good player, do you really want to isolate them in order to go into the hand with AQs out of position. Of course, if you flop a monster or monster draw, then that would be fine, but in most cases, the best you may flop is an A or Q, and those hands are a lot harder to play OOP, and you could find yourself in a lot of trouble. Or, in most cases, you'll flop air and then a player with worse holdings, but position could steal the pot from you.

#31 Mercury69

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Posted 20 August 2012 - 10:25 AM

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#32 SirRawrsALot

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Posted 20 August 2012 - 11:45 AM

Hand 1 - I'm folding pre. It may seem nitty, but low SCs play horrible OOP. You can make bad 2 pair hands, bad flushes, and straights (which are more than likely to be not-nut straights). A lot of reverse implied odds, imo. I will generally folding SCs like this in EP untill you get to like 76s/78s. As played, I'm folding. With the reads you've given us on SB, no way he 4 bets this flop with less than 54. It almost has to been K4, K5, 44 or 55. If there was a FD on the flop it may be different since he could have a combo draw with 76s/36s etc...Hand 2 - I think it's a puke fold. His raise is super strong, however, your bet here looks super weak, so he could be trying to take you off a hand like TT or 99 with the raise, but it's hard to fathom he is hoping for a fold with just a min-raise. FWIW, I hate betting the turn. I think we fold out almost everything we beat, while anything beating us is probably going for a c/r.Hand 3 - If he is shoving for $100 total than it's a snap, and given your read, be prepared to be behind like always. You're pot size is wrong. 100 (his shove) + 28 (two callers for $14) + 46 (your raise) = $174. You're getting better than 3-1, it's a call. I kinda like the 3-bet. The nit/opener only has $100, so if you 3-bet and he shoves you're not losing too much, plus flatting here with AQs OOP is going to cause a lot of problems. Plus, there's a bunch of dead money in there.Edit - mis-read the HH the first time for hand 3, though UTG+3 was the one who shoved. IMO, it makes it more of a call since there is an extra $18 in the pot. But again, be prepared to see like QQ+, AK like always.




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