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Big Laydown? What's Your Play? Pair 10 Utg V Ak10 Board.


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#1 answer20

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 09:26 AM

In the trend of 'what's your play' blogging that is going on ... that I extremely enjoy ... I have one of my own that I can put out there to see what is in your playbook. I am a mid-loose-aggressive 1-2, 2-5 player who doesn't mind playing OOP because I play in charity cards rooms where I am quite familiar with the players I am against ... and accept the fact that they are quite familiar with my wide range of opening hands as well. We mostly play 1-2 with stacks of $100 to $400, 10-handed, but the play can be 2-5ish with 4 or 5 of the players since we normally can't get the 2-5 going very much.This hand is about 1.5 hours into a session with very little change at the table. I open UTG with 10c10h to $12 and get 6 callers. Yes, welcome to my world!! I normally get 4 or 5 callers with that opening bet since they 'know' me so well. So we see a Flop of AsKs10d with $84 in the pot. I choose not to slow play this although I might check since I can use my 'rep' to my advantage in these cases, but with 7 people in the hand I lead out with $34 as the SB and BB didn't play. Although $34 is not a huge bet with relation to the pot, it is considered a 'big' bet relative to how most people at the table 'value' their dollars, which is a very important cash game nugget to understand.UTG+1 calls, fold, fold, fold, fold ... Button goes all in for $212!! So I am looking at $178 to call with one behind, who only has $165 in his stack left. How do you approach this 'opportunity'? So I could be calling $178 into what could be a $482 main pot and a $13 side pot. I am getting 3 to 1, which is a decent price. Here's my line of thinking ...A) I was more than likely ahead pre-flop except to maybe the first 2 callers (one of which is still in the hand) as any big pair or even AK or AQ may have 3-bet me pre-Flop with so many callers down the line. Big pair limping runs wild at times in this room!!B) I am against 2 of these 4 hands (maybe all 4 in a sick combo form) ... flush draw, made straight, 2-pair, pair with straight or flush draw.C) I may not be drawing to the best hand even if I am ahead at the moment ... larger full house is possible.D) Although I need both players in the hand to get a good price, I don't really want to go against multiple draws/made hands ... and those hands may have some of my draw cards.E) I REALLY think that UTG+1 is going to call based on smooth call, player knowledge and behavior after the Button all-in.So with all that information ... Do I even consider a fold? I have made some incredible lay downs in front of these people before, but I don't think either of these players is making a move here. I think one of the biggest considerations here is that there are 2 cards coming, not just one. I probably don't put too much consideration into putting chips in here after a blank on the Turn.I will let you know what I did and what the other 2 players had once I get a few responses ... Thanks ...

#2 Ninja Ace

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 12:12 PM

Bet moreInsta ship
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QUOTE (QED @ Monday, May 24th, 2010, 2:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just got slow rolled by some random with aces, time to take an automatic weapon to the nearest crowded public space.


QUOTE (BaseJester)
"Mixing it up" doesn't magically rationalize anything you do. It's like you walk up to a pencil sharpener, pencil in hand, and think, "Everyone expects me to sharpen this pencil, but I'm going to mix it up." Then you whip out your cock and sharpen that instead and yell, "Ha ha, bitches, you never saw that coming!" Well, no, they didn't. But you still have a dull pencil and bleeding dick.

#3 answer20

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Posted 12 June 2012 - 01:07 PM

Not a cool enough hand I guess ... I don't want to bet more because I want to re-raise this board a lot of times but it is a fair comment since the bet could be called down and prices in most every draw that could be out there.The insta-ship looks good in the math department perhaps ... but I need to play the players here and after quite an extensive tanking I chose to fold and the bet was insta-called by UTG+1 where he promptly showed a made straight and button showed AK for 3rd place as the cards laid if you include my cards. Of course as you all must have concluded ... who actually posts about a hand they won? ... An Ace peeled off on the Turn and the button scopped the pot!!I showed the 10-10 after the call by UTG+1 and the table didn't believe it ... I probably would have considered it more if the side pot had been bigger. It just didn't feel right at the time and I went with my read and it 'paid' off. As you see in many poker books ... money not in the pot is money not lost and you can consider it a positive in your mind if you need it too.

#4 fighter

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Posted 12 June 2012 - 02:42 PM

View Postanswer20, on 01 June 2012 - 09:26 AM, said:

Although $34 is not a huge bet with relation to the pot, it is considered a 'big' bet relative to how most people at the table 'value' their dollars, which is a very important cash game nugget to understand.
This is not good.You are betting less then half the pot on a board where there are draws EVERYWHERE. By betting this amount you are letting pretty much every hand who got a piece of this board make the perfect play since they are getting great odds.If I was to bet $24 into the pot because it is 2x my Preflop raise, so it is 'considered a big bet', you would rightfully think I am incompetent.Your bet is only 5bb more.Defend your hand, someone is going to come with you on this board.AlsoC. is awful reasoning. If you have the best hand, that is the end of thinking. Who cares if you have limited outs if they spike their hand. It is like folding 87 on JT9 because If they have Qx and the K or 8 comes then your drawing dead. It doesn't matter.

View Postanswer20, on 12 June 2012 - 01:07 PM, said:

Not a cool enough hand I guess ... I don't want to bet more because I want to re-raise this board a lot of times but it is a fair comment since the bet could be called down and prices in most every draw that could be out there.The insta-ship looks good in the math department perhaps ... but I need to play the players here and after quite an extensive tanking I chose to fold and the bet was insta-called by UTG+1 where he promptly showed a made straight and button showed AK for 3rd place as the cards laid if you include my cards. Of course as you all must have concluded ... who actually posts about a hand they won? ... An Ace peeled off on the Turn and the button scopped the pot!!I showed the 10-10 after the call by UTG+1 and the table didn't believe it ... I probably would have considered it more if the side pot had been bigger. It just didn't feel right at the time and I went with my read and it 'paid' off. As you see in many poker books ... money not in the pot is money not lost and you can consider it a positive in your mind if you need it too.
I don't like this fold and you reasoning seems to be results orientated thinking.Great the guy who smooth called had a better hand. However because of the amount you bet, he could have also had,AQ,AJ, AT, AK, KT, QT,JT, KQ ,KJ , any spade draw, AsXx maybe even just Qx and Jx . If he had any of those hands he would just call and because of the amount you bet he wouldn't of been making a mistake. It would be a very profitable and easy call.You had the guy who shoved, beat (AK). He could have also had KT,AT, Qs9s,QsTs, JsTs,Js9s, KT, maybe AsXx or AxQs, all of which you beat.So in summationBet more and Insta ship

#5 mtdesmoines

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Posted 14 June 2012 - 08:21 PM

View PostNinja Ace, on 01 June 2012 - 12:12 PM, said:

Bet moreInsta ship
+ most of fighter's post.
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