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The Media Lynching Of Joe Paterno


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#1 Zealous Donkey

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 03:50 AM

Joe deserves a lot of what he is getting, and I am sure more damning information will come to the surface in the near future, but the media attention this is getting in something I will never understand. Here is the grand jury testimony, http://www.attorneyg...Presentment.pdfWhat do you think? Why is this such a huge story, but Cory Feldman revealing last month in an interview that he, Cory Haim, and he suspected several others were passed around by Hollywood Big Wigs like sex toys. Yet, no cameras or satellite trucks parked outside of Steven Speilberg's or Rob Reiners house. No one asking them how much they knew and when they knew it. No interest at all. Roman Polanski? The Catholic Church, Front Page news for months over decades old accusations, people calling for Pope to be arrested. Yet child sexual abuse is according to at least one study as much as 100 times more prevalent in the public school system than in the Catholic Church. Why no media coverage? Why hasn't Arne Duncan been arrested? How many teachers have re offended because they were protected by the unions? But Joe Paterno was told of the abuse of a boy, the abuser being a former assistant coach, Paterno informed his supervisors. It isn't known what kind of follow up Paterno did if any. What should he have done? Make a citizen's arrest? Conduct his own parallel investigation along side whatever investigation his superiors initiated? Don't get me wrong, Paterno has admitted hindsight being 20/20 he should have done more. I have no doubt that there is a lot more he could have and should have done. But if you have been watching the media, you would think Paterno was the one who abused the kid, he is shown and mentioned much more than the actual offender who hasn't been an employee of the university since 1999, though he was still had access to the campus.
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#2 iZuma

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 04:27 AM

wait, the coreys were raped too?

#3 LongLiveYorke

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 05:59 AM

To complain about what gets media attention is to plow the seas.

#4 BaseJester

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 06:19 AM

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 6:50 AM, said:

Yet child sexual abuse is according to at least one study as much as 100 times more prevalent in the public school system than in the Catholic Church.
Bullshit.It's wasn't a study. It was a statement made in an interview. The statement is comparing the number of allegations made in the Catholic Church to a survey. It's a highly questionable argument in the first place. But you took in a step further yet by saying this makes abuse "more prevalent" in public schools. The way that Shakeshaft arrives at the 290,000 estimate is by multiplying an incidence rate by the very large number of children in public schools. Even she isn't making a claim about the prevalence of abuse; she's making a claim about the absolute magnitude of the abuses.Prevalence

'MW' said:

Definition of PREVALENCE1: the quality or state of being prevalent2: the degree to which something is prevalent; especially : the percentage of a population that is affected with a particular disease at a given time
http://www.freerepub...s/1094835/posts

Quote

The best data available suggest that nearly 10 percent of American students are targets of unwanted sexual attention by public school employees—ranging from sexual comments to rape—at some point during their school-age years, Ms. Shakeshaft said."So we think the Catholic Church has a problem?" she said.To support her contention that many more youngsters have been sexually mistreated by school employees than by priests, Ms. Shakeshaft pointed to research conducted for the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops and released late last month. That study found that from 1950 to 2002, 10,667 people made allegations that priests or deacons had sexually abused them as minors. ("Report Tallies Alleged Sexual Abuse by Priests," this issue.)Extrapolating from data collected in a national survey for the American Association of University Women Educational Foundation in 2000, Ms. Shakeshaft estimated that roughly 290,000 students experienced some sort of physical sexual abuse by a public school employee from 1991 to 2000—a single decade, compared with the roughly five-decade period examined in the study of Catholic priests.Those figures suggest that "the physical sexual abuse of students in schools is likely more than 100 times the abuse by priests,"contended Ms. Shakeshaft, who is a professor of educational administration at Hofstra, in Hempstead, N.Y.Kathleen Lyons, a spokeswoman for the National Education Association, called it "a misuse of the data to imply that public schools and the Catholic Church have experienced the same level of abuse cases.""I take great umbrage at that suggestion," she said in an interview. "That just seems like someone is reaching conclusions based on half the data that's needed."Ms. Shakeshaft acknowledged that the accuracy of such comparisons might be thrown off by any number of factors, including undercounting of youngsters abused by priests. But that uncertainty only underscores the need for better research on the prevalence of sexual misconduct in the schools, she argued.

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#5 mk

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 06:54 AM

no one took corey haim seriously because he was a degen drug addict obviously looking to make money selling sensational tabloid yarns.a sober graduate assistant with no obvious motivation to defame someone seems a much more credible source.manzanas y naranjas

#6 irishguy

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 06:57 AM

Yes it's not right that Paterno is getting all the attention and the disgusting issue at hand is kind of pushed to the back. Had he handled it better in the first place or as soon as it came out it would've died down. Instead when he finally made a statement he arrogantly decided to retire at the end of the season thus keeping himself front and center in the eyes of the media. The minute it all came out the proper thing to do was to state that he followed school protocol and reported what he had been told but that he often struggled with whether he could've/should've done more and in light of the facts available now he knows he was wrong to not take further action and because he didn't want to be a distraction to his team/school and didn't want to take attention away from the issue at hand he was stepping down immediately. And that while he appreciates the support that the support should be directed towards the victims and their families. If he would've handled it like that it would be much less of a "media lynching"....
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#7 CaneBrain

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 07:04 AM

meh, Joe is an employee of a university and therefore has a stronger duty to investigate than just another guy. I think he got what he deserved.....he lost the right to go out on his own terms and his flawless reputation was forever tarnished. He won't end up in any legal trouble because legally he did what was right. But morally? I think he should have done a lot more. It sounds a lot like Joe Pa stuck his head in the sand and hoped the whole thing would just go away. I'm sure many people would have done the same. But he failed in his primary role as an educator by doing so and deserves to be fired (but no more).Sure, the media likes having a big name involved but over time the true anger will end up where it belongs with Sandusky and people who had a much more active role in the cover-up. I think you are imagining that the media is blaming Paterno more than anyone else. The guilt of most parties is extremely cut and dried. Paterno's guilt is far more of a gray area and gray areas are much more interesting to cover. There are not a lot of ways you can say Sandusky should burn in hell because that is the only logical response.And for the love of Catholicism, please stop trying to pretend that the Catholic abuse scandal was some unfair media creation. When you hold yourself out as a moral authority directly from God and then do everything you can to cover up the molesters in your midst......come on. The problem was never the prevalence of the abuse. It was always the PROVEN cover-up that occurred for decades. Just like PSU would not have gotten in trouble for having a staff member who molested kids. You can't know the heart of everyone. But they covered it up. DON'T COVER IT UP. Pretty simple.Comparing this to Corey Haim and Feldman is also a joke. In the PSU case we have stuff like, tons of evidence. All we have re: Hollywood is the word of two people who are notorious for drug use, outlandish statements and ridiculous lifestyles. You can't possibly be equating the two can you? You realize the Coreys are huge attention seeking jokes, right?I realize your big thing is "media bias" these days but most of what you wrote is either apologist nonsense or an attempt to draw parallels that don't exist. Comparing the PSU scandal with its 14 month investigation, grand jury testimony, multiple witnesses and victims who have come forward to Corey effing Haim saying something in an interview after his 11th rehab stint....lol.
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#8 Zealous Donkey

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:08 AM

View PostCaneBrain, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 10:04 AM, said:

meh, Joe is an employee of a university and therefore has a stronger duty to investigate than just another guy. I think he got what he deserved.....he lost the right to go out on his own terms and his flawless reputation was forever tarnished. He won't end up in any legal trouble because legally he did what was right. But morally? I think he should have done a lot more. It sounds a lot like Joe Pa stuck his head in the sand and hoped the whole thing would just go away. I'm sure many people would have done the same. But he failed in his primary role as an educator by doing so and deserves to be fired (but no more).Sure, the media likes having a big name involved but over time the true anger will end up where it belongs with Sandusky and people who had a much more active role in the cover-up. I think you are imagining that the media is blaming Paterno more than anyone else. The guilt of most parties is extremely cut and dried. Paterno's guilt is far more of a gray area and gray areas are much more interesting to cover. There are not a lot of ways you can say Sandusky should burn in hell because that is the only logical response.And for the love of Catholicism, please stop trying to pretend that the Catholic abuse scandal was some unfair media creation. When you hold yourself out as a moral authority directly from God and then do everything you can to cover up the molesters in your midst......come on. The problem was never the prevalence of the abuse. It was always the PROVEN cover-up that occurred for decades. Just like PSU would not have gotten in trouble for having a staff member who molested kids. You can't know the heart of everyone. But they covered it up. DON'T COVER IT UP. Pretty simple.Comparing this to Corey Haim and Feldman is also a joke. In the PSU case we have stuff like, tons of evidence. All we have re: Hollywood is the word of two people who are notorious for drug use, outlandish statements and ridiculous lifestyles. You can't possibly be equating the two can you? You realize the Coreys are huge attention seeking jokes, right?I realize your big thing is "media bias" these days but most of what you wrote is either apologist nonsense or an attempt to draw parallels that don't exist. Comparing the PSU scandal with its 14 month investigation, grand jury testimony, multiple witnesses and victims who have come forward to Corey effing Haim saying something in an interview after his 11th rehab stint....lol.
Well, if they had the same attitude as you there never would have been an investigation. It is easy to write two people off because you don't like them. Unfortunately alcohol and drug abuse are common in sexual abuse victims. Some are introduced to alcohol at a young age by their perps. BTW it was Corey Feldman that made accusations in the interview. I am sure his abusers hope everyone shares your attitude towards the Coreys". The only two attention seeking, drug using, folks, with outlandish lifestyles in Hollywood. But since Hollywood doesn't hold itself at as a moral authority it should be beyond reproach and allegations ignored. In fact passing around a petition to be signed in support of Roman Polanski who drugged and raped a 13 year old girl, is understandable and acceptable.
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#9 Zealous Donkey

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:17 AM

View Postirishguy, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 9:57 AM, said:

Yes it's not right that Paterno is getting all the attention and the disgusting issue at hand is kind of pushed to the back. Had he handled it better in the first place or as soon as it came out it would've died down. Instead when he finally made a statement he arrogantly decided to retire at the end of the season thus keeping himself front and center in the eyes of the media. The minute it all came out the proper thing to do was to state that he followed school protocol and reported what he had been told but that he often struggled with whether he could've/should've done more and in light of the facts available now he knows he was wrong to not take further action and because he didn't want to be a distraction to his team/school and didn't want to take attention away from the issue at hand he was stepping down immediately. And that while he appreciates the support that the support should be directed towards the victims and their families. If he would've handled it like that it would be much less of a "media lynching"....
I agree with everything you state here accept that it would have been less of a lynching. When all the facts come out I think Paterno will look bad, even to more fair minded, honest people than the news media. Their were allegations in 1998 of the same sort, (giving head to underage boy in shower) Sandusky didn't coach in 1999. He went from being the heir apparent to being out of a job. The timing of his dismissal makes this seem more than a coincidence. But in 1998 the authorities were involved, I wonder why they didn't take this any further.
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#10 hblask

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:20 AM

Paterno had to know that he was an influential major figure. For him to allow this to be swept under the rug in inexcusable.Think about it, if you caught your neighbor with a little boy, would you rest before he was in jail? I wouldn't, and someone in the public eye has an even stronger responsibility to follow through. He put winning and the reputation of their athletic program ahead of the well-being of children, and he can burn in hell now.
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#11 Dread Aidan

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:29 AM

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 3:50 AM, said:

the media attention this is getting in something I will never understand.
Really? REALLY???

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 3:50 AM, said:

But Joe Paterno was told of the abuse of a boy, the abuser being a former assistant coach, Paterno informed his supervisors. It isn't known what kind of follow up Paterno did if any. What should he have done? Make a citizen's arrest? Conduct his own parallel investigation along side whatever investigation his superiors initiated?
No, you're totally right; just throw your hands up in the air and say, "Well, I told my supervisor, nothing else I can do." Especially since Paterno didn't have any power around the campus or anything like that. His hands were tied.

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 3:50 AM, said:

But if you have been watching the media, you would think Paterno was the one who abused the kid, he is shown and mentioned much more than the actual offender who hasn't been an employee of the university since 1999, though he was still had access to the campus.
I'd love to see the media coverage be all about Sandusky and how that would go.Chris Berman: So it looks like Jerry San-"dusky in the Wind" raped a whole bunch of kids.Tom Jackson: Yes, Boomer, truly awful. [lowers head and shakes it slowly]Chris Berman: I don't think he'll be backbackbackback at Penn State anytime soon.Tom Jackson: I wouldn't think so, Boomer.Chris Berman: I mean he...could....go...all...the...way...to the slammer!Tom Jackson: I don't think this is appropriate, Boom.That....wasn't where I intended to take that. Anyway, there is universal consensus that what Sandusky did was just about the worst thing imaginable. There's nothing to debate or discuss there. Paterno knew about what happened and all he did was one step above nothing. It's inexcusable, indefensible, and he deserves the firing and the "media lynching."

#12 Zealous Donkey

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:31 AM

View PostBaseJester, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 9:19 AM, said:

Bullshit.It's wasn't a study. It was a statement made in an interview. The statement is comparing the number of allegations made in the Catholic Church to a survey. It's a highly questionable argument in the first place. But you took in a step further yet by saying this makes abuse "more prevalent" in public schools. The way that Shakeshaft arrives at the 290,000 estimate is by multiplying an incidence rate by the very large number of children in public schools. Even she isn't making a claim about the prevalence of abuse; she's making a claim about the absolute magnitude of the abuses.Prevalencehttp://www.freerepub...s/1094835/posts
Sorry, you are correct I shouldn't have used the word prevalent. It is of course obvious that there is no problem with sexual abuse anywhere but the Catholic Church. Even if anyone was actually abused by a public school teacher, (which I am sure rarely if ever has happened) it wouldn't be that big a deal because public schools don't claim to be a moral authority like the Catholic Church.
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#13 CaneBrain

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:32 AM

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 11:08 AM, said:

Well, if they had the same attitude as you there never would have been an investigation. It is easy to write two people off because you don't like them. Unfortunately alcohol and drug abuse are common in sexual abuse victims. Some are introduced to alcohol at a young age by their perps. BTW it was Corey Feldman that made accusations in the interview. I am sure his abusers hope everyone shares your attitude towards the Coreys". The only two attention seeking, drug using, folks, with outlandish lifestyles in Hollywood. But since Hollywood doesn't hold itself at as a moral authority it should be beyond reproach and allegations ignored. In fact passing around a petition to be signed in support of Roman Polanski who drugged and raped a 13 year old girl, is understandable and acceptable.
And if they ever have any evidence of it they should totally share that with the class. Or they can file a formal complaint with the police. if they did that, the police would have no choice but to at least investigate it. Why haven't they done so? I am sure it is because both of them are completely full of crap and the fact that you sit here and throw around stuff like "his abusers" like it's a concrete fact because he said it on AN INTERVIEW that one time is completely laughable. The fact that he will say something sensational during an interview but won't go to the police should tell you something about his motives.The case against PSU and the Catholic Church is based on provable evidence and victims who actually came forward and went to the police instead of making vague accusations on TV. Your crusade against Hollywood and the Media is obvious but you are not remotely bringing up equivalent situations here. Also, authorities have attempted to extradite Roman Polanski for years. It's not like there are not forces trying to bring him to trial. Blame Switzerland and malleable extradition laws.
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#14 CaneBrain

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:35 AM

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 11:31 AM, said:

Sorry, you are correct I shouldn't have used the word prevalent. It is of course obvious that there is no problem with sexual abuse anywhere but the Catholic Church. Even if anyone was actually abused by a public school teacher, (which I am sure rarely if ever has happened) it wouldn't be that big a deal because public schools don't claim to be a moral authority like the Catholic Church.
It's pretty transparent why you keep honing in on what I said about the moral authority part of my argument against the Catholic Church. It's because you have no answer for the "they covered it up for years and we have lots of evidence that they did part". However, ignoring it is not fooling anyone.Again, if you have any evidence that public schools engaged in a systemic, decades-long cover-up designed to ****ING PROTECT child molesters and not even fire them but move them around from city to city to inflict more pedophilia on more kids, please share it with the class. Until then, you don't have a leg to stand on so just stop embarrassing yourself.
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#15 mrdannyg

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:40 AM

View PostDread Aidan, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 1:29 PM, said:

I'd love to see the media coverage be all about Sandusky and how that would go.Chris Berman: So it looks like Jerry San-"dusky in the Wind" raped a whole bunch of kids.Tom Jackson: Yes, Boomer, truly awful. [lowers head and shakes it slowly]Chris Berman: I don't think he'll be backbackbackback at Penn State anytime soon.Tom Jackson: I wouldn't think so, Boomer.Chris Berman: I mean he...could....go...all...the...way...to the slammer!Tom Jackson: I don't think this is appropriate, Boom.
This was nothing short of absolute brilliance. Seriously, send that in to someone, the world needs to see it.
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#16 Dread Aidan

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:41 AM

Z-Donk, I think this is what you want to say.I love Pos. This doesn't change my opinion.

View Postmrdannyg, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 8:40 AM, said:

This was nothing short of absolute brilliance. Seriously, send that in to someone, the world needs to see it.
Thanks.

#17 irishguy

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:45 AM

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 9:31 AM, said:

Sorry, you are correct I shouldn't have used the word prevalent. It is of course obvious that there is no problem with sexual abuse anywhere but the Catholic Church. Even if anyone was actually abused by a public school teacher, (which I am sure rarely if ever has happened) it wouldn't be that big a deal because public schools don't claim to be a moral authority like the Catholic Church.
How you took any of the post you quoted and thought this was a reasonable response is baffling... Also there is a huge difference between the penn state scandal and allegations made by Corey whatever...Should they be investigated? Maybe, but as an adult looking back at abuse he says happened he now has an obligation if true to offer evidence and push for an investigation in order to protect current or future victims rather then just spouting off allegations.. As for Paterno I agree the firing is sufficient and he shouldn't face charges. McCready should have been fired as well.
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#18 CaneBrain

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:46 AM

View PostDread Aidan, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 11:41 AM, said:

Z-Donk, I think this is what you want to say.I love Pos. This doesn't change my opinion.Thanks.
liked this line:"But I will say this: Paterno has paid a price here. His job is gone. His life’s work has been soiled. His reputation is in tatters. Maybe that should be the price."I think it should be the price and in a few years people will remember who the real villains are in this case and start to remember Paterno more fairly. I think Pos is right about assumptions being made about what Paterno did or did not know but I think one assumption that is proven by the evidence I have seen is that Paterno could have done a lot more. That's not necessarily the fairest standard but life isn't fair.
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#19 Zealous Donkey

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:52 AM

View PostLongLiveYorke, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 8:59 AM, said:

To complain about what gets media attention is to plow the seas.
I know you are right, but I am fascinated by what drives them. And I am not saying it isn't a legitimate story, but how it pushes so hard for judgement to be passed publicly in this case, I just am trying to figure out why this case?
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#20 CaneBrain

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 09:00 AM

View PostZealous Donkey, on Friday, November 11th, 2011, 11:52 AM, said:

I know you are right, but I am fascinated by what drives them. And I am not saying it isn't a legitimate story, but how it pushes so hard for judgement to be passed publicly in this case, I just am trying to figure out why this case?
In this narrow line of thought, I think Joe Paterno's squeaky clean reputation and legendary status is working against him. We love to knock people off pedestals these days or see stars get humbled (though I don't think the media has an agenda for certain people. This is just how we are. See: the continued hatred of everything Lebron does.) I don't agree with everything Posnanski says but some of it is true.
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