Jump to content


#occupywallstreet Or Bourbonstreet Or Sesamestreet


  • Please log in to reply
386 replies to this topic

#41 mrdannyg

mrdannyg

    Cheese Salesman

  • Members
  • 20,246 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 11 October 2011 - 04:21 AM

View PostAmScray, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:33 AM, said:

Nothing. We'd have to accept that freedom of speech cannot be contained and that some people have more resources than others to get their message our further. The reason the National Rifle Association has so much money and influence is because they are an organization that represents the interests of old white men, who themselves have all the chips. It's not like the NRA is disproportionately sized, relative to the power and influence of their member base. White guys are control freaks who like what guns represent. Homosexuals, women, Jews, etc don't come from the same culture as old white men, so they tend to not like them. If the NRA (or trade unions, or gays, or whoever) wants to influence candidates with the threat of ideas, I'm totally cool with that. I'm OK with them saying "If you don't support us, we're running ads against you..." That politician then has to make an ideological decision, however, I'm sure he can find some gay SEO expert who's willing to donate his time and can achieve a similar reach for 1/1000th the cost. Maybe it's because I'm from Chicago where we have (bar none) the most rotten, openly corrupt political culture in the entire United States, but there's a big difference between trying to win influence in the pantheon of ideas versus buying influence with a manilla envelope full of cash. If a corporation or group entity wants to present their case for a candidate, then make a law that says any 30 second political ads paid for by a third party must contain a 5 second disclaimer (2.5 front, 2.5 back) that clearly outlined who paid for it.Make a law forbidding PACs and made-to-order political shell organizations from running political ads- entities that only exist to hide the identities of who's funding the ads... Anyone can run a political ad in this country, so long as they're an individual person or a credible entity that exists for purposes other than running political ads. Defining a credible group from a non-credible made to order PAC would be dead simple and revolve around tax returns. If we can define a bar as any establishment that derives (X%) of its income from the sale of alcohol, then we can define a PAC as any institution that spends (X%) of its donations on political activities, then ****ing ban them. Is it a can of worms? Yes. Nightmarishly complicated? Yes. Would it take some time to bulletproof? Yes. It's a rough issue, but its one we have to tackle. We're currently a Plutocracy, and it's killing our country.
This is an idea that would only vaguely work, in hugely problematic ways, and with moral gaps you could drive a bus through.Still better than what we have now.

View PostSpademan, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 7:59 AM, said:

Holy fucking Xenu*. This is the first post in the first forum, scrolling down from top, I'd respond to. I'll use this as my catch-all. This goes for this forum, the religion forum and off-topic. These are the only forums I've caught/kept up with in any way.Most of you are idiots. The level of argument is almost devoid of content, evidence, or reason. mk and FCP Bob are the only two who seem to absolutely care about epistemology. VB and LLY are clearly good at methodology (omg, they became scientists for a living... how shocking), and how good they are at testing and retesting and only accepting as a conclusion something that relates to observational reality is clear. But rhetorically... holy hell. So much faux "respect" given to nonsense, and more important so many opportunities to annihilate stupid argumetns passed. This is a matter of social weakness, and in no way disparaging of intellect. Maybe you're too busy to spend the three minutes necessary, an hour total a month for me, to parse and respond to ignorance in an effective way. This can be as simple as making meme out of a three-trick-pony style of a commenter. Yes, I said social weakness. Parse that rationally and deal with it. A special spot at the end here reserved for two posters:1. Scram. Fook, a brilliant and funny guy. In terms of raw intellect he is one of the top 3, including myself of course because I am nothing if not consistent in my estimation of of my greatness... holy shit Scram you go with fairly reasonable assumptions too often. I'm INTJ in terms of Jung and even I know better than to overstep the bounds of demonstrable reality.2. TB. Shining light of reason (and the resultant eloquence), self deprecation (which is a result of the former) and humor (which is a natural by-product of the former and the latter combined). Easy top three. But wtf are you talking about in the religion thread? Seriously, WAT? The absurd equivalence you made between religious faith and reason based argumentation is, seriously, stupid.*This is an effort to be informative without humor, cynicism or despair. All three probably still manifested themselves in some way.
As per usual, a post ironically devoid of content, usefulness or reason. Plenty of spittle though, much like our off-topic forums.
Long signatures are really annoying.

#42 LongLiveYorke

LongLiveYorke

    Ending the world one proton at a time

  • Members
  • 8,356 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manhattan
  • Interests:fizziks, teh maths, Raid-o-head, Rod Reynolds

Posted 11 October 2011 - 04:49 AM

View PostSpademan, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 6:59 AM, said:

VB and LLY are clearly good at methodology (omg, they became scientists for a living... how shocking), and how good they are at testing and retesting and only accepting as a conclusion something that relates to observational reality is clear. But rhetorically... holy hell. So much faux "respect" given to nonsense, and more important so many opportunities to annihilate stupid argumetns passed. This is a matter of social weakness, and in no way disparaging of intellect. Maybe you're too busy to spend the three minutes necessary, an hour total a month for me, to parse and respond to ignorance in an effective way. This can be as simple as making meme out of a three-trick-pony style of a commenter. Yes, I said social weakness. Parse that rationally and deal with it.
Yeah, clearly. My only counter-argument is that it's not necessarily our goal (nor do we have time) to win every argument or jump on every false point. But this indeed is the very thing that you're calling a social-weakness. So, I guess my counter-argument is somewhat vacuous...

#43 Balloon guy

Balloon guy

    Deplorable Lives Matter

  • Members
  • 24,371 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:So Cal
  • Interests:Cigars, Flying, Golf, Bible
  • Favorite Poker Game:Golf

Posted 11 October 2011 - 07:27 AM

View PostFCP Bob, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:52 AM, said:

I had to look that up to make sure that what I care about is a good thing.
If a woman doesn't get one she can rip during child birth.That just hurts thinking about it.
I use my cigar smoke as idiot repellent

The government was set to protect man from criminals - and the Constitution was written to protect man from the government. - Ayn Rand

#44 vbnautilus

vbnautilus

    psychonaut

  • Members
  • 10,326 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:venice beach, ca

Posted 11 October 2011 - 09:22 AM

View PostSpademan, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 3:59 AM, said:

VB and LLY are clearly good at methodology (omg, they became scientists for a living... how shocking), and how good they are at testing and retesting and only accepting as a conclusion something that relates to observational reality is clear. But rhetorically... holy hell. So much faux "respect" given to nonsense, and more important so many opportunities to annihilate stupid argumetns passed. This is a matter of social weakness, and in no way disparaging of intellect. Maybe you're too busy to spend the three minutes necessary, an hour total a month for me, to parse and respond to ignorance in an effective way. This can be as simple as making meme out of a three-trick-pony style of a commenter. Yes, I said social weakness. Parse that rationally and deal with it.
I've thought about this and while I don't disagree with any of it, I think there is a good reason for it, which is along the lines of what LLY said: I value the people I am arguing with more than the argument itself. Ultimately, the only way to communicate with people is to have some kind of workable relationship with them, and if you destroy that relationship in the process of proving them wrong, assuming you are right you have ended your potential for leading someone else to the truth. I'm not as interested in the actual logic of the arguments as I once was. What is more interesting to me now is trying to figure out the path from where someone else is to where I am. Therefore argument is more an exercise in perspective taking than anything else, which involves some degree of "faux respect" because no one is stupid from their own perspective.**except maybe balloon guy

#45 mk

mk

    nord-américain racaille

  • Members
  • 9,873 posts

Posted 11 October 2011 - 09:31 AM

View PostSpademan, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 5:59 AM, said:

2. TB. Shining light of reason (and the resultant eloquence), self deprecation (which is a result of the former) and humor (which is a natural by-product of the former and the latter combined). Easy top three. But wtf are you talking about in the religion thread?
Is TB Tactical Bear? He still posts but only in the religion forum?

#46 LongLiveYorke

LongLiveYorke

    Ending the world one proton at a time

  • Members
  • 8,356 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manhattan
  • Interests:fizziks, teh maths, Raid-o-head, Rod Reynolds

Posted 11 October 2011 - 09:42 AM

View Postmk, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 1:31 PM, said:

Is TB Tactical Bear? He still posts but only in the religion forum?
I assumed it was Tobias Bluth. No?

#47 hblask

hblask

    Perpetual slow learner

  • Members
  • 9,860 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Minnesota
  • Interests:Just deal the cards already

Posted 11 October 2011 - 01:52 PM

View PostSpademan, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:59 AM, said:

mk and FCP Bob are the only two who seem to absolutely care about epistemology.
Yeah, you lost me there. From what I can tell, mk is only interested in sniping insults and running away. If that's what epistemology means, he's the king, but FCP Bob is the exact opposite of that.
"Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you?" -- J. Coulton


#48 vbnautilus

vbnautilus

    psychonaut

  • Members
  • 10,326 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:venice beach, ca

Posted 11 October 2011 - 02:37 PM

View Posthblask, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 2:52 PM, said:

Yeah, you lost me there. From what I can tell, mk is only interested in sniping insults and running away. If that's what epistemology means, he's the king, but FCP Bob is the exact opposite of that.
How would you know?

#49 hblask

hblask

    Perpetual slow learner

  • Members
  • 9,860 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Minnesota
  • Interests:Just deal the cards already

Posted 11 October 2011 - 02:45 PM

View Postvbnautilus, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:37 PM, said:

How would you know?
Know what? That mk is a troll, or that Bob is serious?
"Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you?" -- J. Coulton


#50 mrdannyg

mrdannyg

    Cheese Salesman

  • Members
  • 20,246 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 11 October 2011 - 03:29 PM

View Posthblask, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 6:52 PM, said:

Yeah, you lost me there. From what I can tell, mk is only interested in sniping insults and running away. If that's what epistemology means, he's the king, but FCP Bob is the exact opposite of that.
In this forum at least, mk is closer to episiotomy than epistemology!**Pretend you read this joke before everyone else implying it.
Long signatures are really annoying.

#51 AmScray

AmScray

    Honk

  • Members
  • 4,005 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Favorite Poker Game:wrhsf235yu

Posted 12 October 2011 - 02:26 AM

View Postmrdannyg, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:21 AM, said:

This is an idea that would only vaguely work, in hugely problematic ways, and with moral gaps you could drive a bus through.
Posted Image

View Postmrdannyg, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:21 AM, said:

As per usual, a post ironically devoid of content, usefulness or reason.

Posted Image

#52 Balloon guy

Balloon guy

    Deplorable Lives Matter

  • Members
  • 24,371 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:So Cal
  • Interests:Cigars, Flying, Golf, Bible
  • Favorite Poker Game:Golf

Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:47 AM

Sign of their demise?53 people show up at DC Rally

Quote

Attempting to emulate the Occupy Wall Street protests, Washington activists and some out-of-town guests set themselves the lofty goal of occupying the Hart Senate Office Building. “We are there to shut the place down!” organizer David Swanson told his small band of followers.But how to do this with only a few dozen demonstrators? Well, Swanson said, they could push all the buttons on the elevators — the way naughty children sometimes do in apartment buildings. “There are people who are wanting to go into the elevators and fill them and not get out and push all the buttons,” he said. “If you like that, do it.”This set off a lengthy debate in Freedom Plaza, at the corner of Pennsylvania Avenue and 14th Street NW, as activists came to the microphone to argue the pros and cons of elevator disruption.“Let’s face it, our numbers are not enough to shut this building down,” said the representative from Veterans for Peace. “I think pushing elevator buttons is stupid.”A woman wearing a Planned Parenthood pin and a “U.S. Boat to Gaza” T-shirt was ambivalent. “I’m ready to take over and shut down that building,” she said. “We don’t have that many people, but we need to do it. Maybe standing in elevators isn’t going to do it, but we need to figure it out.”Swanson was adamant. “We should be blocking down the elevators, blocking down the bathrooms,” he said, before designating an “elevator team” dedicated to the purpose. “We’re going after the building precisely to inconvenience everybody who works there.”In the end, they blocked neither elevators nor bathrooms, and inconvenienced nobody but a few Capitol Police officers, who silenced the demonstration after 20 minutes

I use my cigar smoke as idiot repellent

The government was set to protect man from criminals - and the Constitution was written to protect man from the government. - Ayn Rand

#53 strategy

strategy

    Internet expert

  • Members
  • 15,932 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:strategy
  • Favorite Poker Game:strategy

Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:49 AM

those fingers are unnervingly big
QUOTE (ShakeZuma @ Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011, 4:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
seriously though, with that grammar it's really like, I mean it doesn't bother me as much that she gets beat, you know?


#54 akoff

akoff

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 1,942 posts
  • Location:The 700 Level
  • Interests:Golf, investing, Eagles football, golf, baseball, coaching Little League and golf
  • Favorite Poker Game:PLO

Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:50 AM

View PostBalloon guy, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 9:47 AM, said:

Sign of their demise?53 people show up at DC Rally
i wonder why they can't get a job doing something productive in a difficult business enviroment...i find it shocking...somehow i am sure it is racist and most likely W's fault.
"The fact that we are here today to debate raising America 's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the US Government cannot pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government's reckless fiscal policies. Increasing America 's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that, "the buck stops here.' Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better."
~ Senator Barack H. Obama

#55 strategy

strategy

    Internet expert

  • Members
  • 15,932 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:strategy
  • Favorite Poker Game:strategy

Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:56 AM

View Postakoff, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 12:50 PM, said:

i wonder why they can't get a job doing something productive in a difficult business enviroment...i find it shocking...somehow i am sure it is racist and most likely W's fault.
in normal times, when it's actually quite easy to get a foot in the door if you put in the effort to get a degree, I don't mind blaming the individual. right now, if you don't have a hard skill, have connections, or have that entrepreneurial drive, you're basically fucked.been saying this for two years, I know, but it's not any less true now...
QUOTE (ShakeZuma @ Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011, 4:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
seriously though, with that grammar it's really like, I mean it doesn't bother me as much that she gets beat, you know?


#56 mk

mk

    nord-américain racaille

  • Members
  • 9,873 posts

Posted 12 October 2011 - 11:39 AM

View PostSpademan, on Wednesday, July 21st, 2010, 6:51 AM, said:

Nearly all of you are fucking idiots.I'm not even going to tell you why, because even more than this, it's a waste of keystrokes.

View Postmk, on Wednesday, July 21st, 2010, 8:26 AM, said:

/thread

View Posthblask, on Tuesday, October 11th, 2011, 4:52 PM, said:

Yeah, you lost me there. From what I can tell, mk is only interested in sniping insults and running away. If that's what epistemology means, he's the king, but FCP Bob is the exact opposite of that.
oh give me a break you fucking idiot

#57 mk

mk

    nord-américain racaille

  • Members
  • 9,873 posts

Posted 12 October 2011 - 11:41 AM

View Poststrategy, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 12:56 PM, said:

in normal times, when it's actually quite easy to get a foot in the door if you put in the effort to get a degree, I don't mind blaming the individual. right now, if you don't have a hard skill, have connections, or have that entrepreneurial drive, you're basically fucked.been saying this for two years, I know, but it's not any less true now...
million dollar idea, putting this on a t-shirt and selling them in front of the cbot. guarantee every trader buys onePosted Image

#58 akoff

akoff

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 1,942 posts
  • Location:The 700 Level
  • Interests:Golf, investing, Eagles football, golf, baseball, coaching Little League and golf
  • Favorite Poker Game:PLO

Posted 12 October 2011 - 12:05 PM

View Poststrategy, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 10:56 AM, said:

in normal times, when it's actually quite easy to get a foot in the door if you put in the effort to get a degree, I don't mind blaming the individual. right now, if you don't have a hard skill, have connections, or have that entrepreneurial drive, you're basically ****ed.been saying this for two years, I know, but it's not any less true now...
i never said it was easy, it never has been easy - right now it is tougher then most but it still can be done...if you don't have a hard skill you should learn one and do general labor until you do, saying it is hard doesn't cut itif you don't have connections you should get your ass out networking in the field you are trained inif you don't have entrepreneurial drive you are going to be at somebody else mercy forever so you had better get used to some tough times.
"The fact that we are here today to debate raising America 's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the US Government cannot pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government's reckless fiscal policies. Increasing America 's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that, "the buck stops here.' Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better."
~ Senator Barack H. Obama

#59 timwakefield

timwakefield

    I haven't got the time time

  • Members
  • 14,413 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Boston
  • Favorite Poker Game:Boxmaha

Posted 12 October 2011 - 12:22 PM

View PostBalloon guy, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 1:47 PM, said:

That article is extremely idiotic, and is extremely poor journalism.

Quote

I don’t say this with satisfaction: A revived populist movement could be a crucial counterweight to the Tea Party, restoring some balance to a political system that has tilted heavily to the right. But while the Occupy movement in the capital has invigorated left-wing groups — Code Pink, Veterans for Peace, Common Dreams, Peace Action, DC Vote, Community Council for the Homeless and a score of other labor and progressive organizations are represented on Freedom Plaza — it has not ignited anything resembling a populist rebellion. To swell their ranks, protesters recruited the homeless to camp with them.
Regarding the bolded, stories I've read and seen about the protests in NY and Boston have noted that homeless people have, unsurprisingly, taken up residence with the protesters. There is free food being given out. There are beds and tents that can be shared. Homeless people obviously feel disenfranchised. Mostly though: free food. The idea that the protesters are recruiting homeless people in order to "swell their ranks" is, to put it nicely, fucking retarded. Our esteemed author offers no evidence for his assertion, and totally ignores the free food angle.

View PostBalloon guy, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 1:47 PM, said:

53 people show up at DC Rally
The Boston protest is growing, and counts among its members a number of veterans, as do the protests in NY and even the one in DC, according to that horrible, horrible article you linked. Anyway, this other article quotes a guy whose last name is apparently Funke, which is amazing. He mentions his son but does not mention his son't first name, so I'm going to assume that it's Tobias.

Quote

Funke spent 13 years on and off in the military, and he served in Vietnam.Now, he is unemployed. He and other members of Veterans for Peace have been at Occupy Boston since the first day, he said.
http://www.boston.co..._common_ground/Boooooo veterans, right!? Damn unemployed-hippie-veterans!!...
Karl: She was a bit -- what's the word that you can use, cuz I don't wanna offend anyone?
Steve: Was she a homeless person?
Karl: Yeah but sort of mental homeless.

#60 vbnautilus

vbnautilus

    psychonaut

  • Members
  • 10,326 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:venice beach, ca

Posted 12 October 2011 - 03:32 PM

View PostBalloon guy, on Wednesday, October 12th, 2011, 10:47 AM, said:

53 people show up at DC Rally
That's probably only 1% of them.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users