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How To Play Early


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#21 30odd6

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 06:23 PM

well true, ive heard limp pre...raise big pre....chk turn...all-in on turn. seems to me no-one knows what is the best way to maximize chip stack in this situation, or minimize losses for that matter. has anyone documented which is the best way? the way i described it is the middle of the road, over time i make lots of chips.

#22 TrueAce13

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 06:33 PM

OK...well limping is best most likely b/c we have a marginal hand. IF you choose to raise, raise 1bb for every limper. Now since we hit top pair. I would bet flop. Now once we get calls, we want to play pot control b/c we don't want to get involved in a huge pot this early. So checking is soooo much better than betting. And fold river
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#23 30odd6

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 06:42 PM

thx true, this is what im looking for. yet im a believer in looking at the math of this. i have him 4:1 and over time, i put myself in a good spot with chip domination. i can see a limp pre and checking cuz over time this way, i lose less. but does anyone really know which is best? i love a big stack and running over the table. but i guess my main question was "how to get around the donks early" and i know waiting for them to make a mistake will benifit me when i have the nuts but 4:1, cmon, i'll take that every day of the week and on weekends lol. and as for the A10s being weak...yes it is but 300 to see a flop and hit big is well worth it and if nothing comes...even a partial piece of it, i can fold easy. saved myself 2 bills every time i go 3bb+1 per limper dont ya think?

#24 TrueAce13

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 07:14 PM

Question: How to get around donkeys in an mttAnswer: Be very patient b/c they will just completely donate their chips to you.
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#25 Tehtoe

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 07:27 PM

View PostTrueAce13, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 9:14 PM, said:

Question: How to get around donkeys in an mttAnswer: Be very patient b/c they will just completely donate their chips to you.
You don't seem to be grasping the question very well tho, how do you maximize your chip stack in this situation.

#26 30odd6

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 07:49 PM

View PostTehtoe, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 9:27 PM, said:

You don't seem to be grasping the question very well tho, how do you maximize your chip stack in this situation.
i just want to say, (here, i'll do it for you LOL LMAO) ive never read a poker book, never really discussed it (im divorced, no kids, not much family and live in the sticks) ive learned everything by my mistakes and studying while playing, yet since 98, i have not worked a job, and pay my bills by poker winnings. never said i was a pro, or a millionaire. i make @3-4,000 a month but aint getting any better so i decided to learn why. i appreciate the help and know there are many styles and the game is getting harder to beat. there is no "right way" to play, but there are ways of making more out of it. i have the skills...chk raising , phantom calls to steal, using position, yet all i really rely on is mathand reading the players cards. its getting very aggressive out there and i'm looking for ways to avoid/punish. thats why i brought this up...which is more profitable in "THE LONG RUN" i play usually 10 tournys a month avg $120 buy-in and some limit (cuz thats all we have in this idotic state with only a $60 max bet at that. 2-60 spread (1/2 blinds) it is mn's version of no limit, how sick! forgive me if i really dig deep, my mind is built that way. once again...thx JOE

#27 texan_driver

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 08:14 PM

30odd6, The main flaw I see is that in tournaments, especially early, I think you should be less concerned about protecting the pot you're in and more concerned about protecting your total stack. That's why people are advocating a check or small bet on the turn. Granted, you are giving your opponent the right odds to continue to the river. But you prevent yourself from getting into a big pot with really only a marginal hand. Losing a big pot early can really put you in a difficult situation in a tourny. It sounds simple, but since you have a medium strength hand, you want to play cautiously and keep the pot small.

#28 donk4life

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 08:15 PM

I'd really like to know where you can live where paying your bills only costs 300-400 a month (Assuming that's what you are saying, it's fairly obvious you don't read period)

View Postakashenk, on 02 August 2012 - 06:44 AM, said:

I don't mind folding out hands we beat.

#29 30odd6

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 08:19 PM

View Postdonk4life, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 10:15 PM, said:

I'd really like to know where you can live where paying your bills only costs 300-400 a month (Assuming that's what you are saying, it's fairly obvious you don't read period)
go kcuf yourself donk! wow! this is the poker community?? great comment! i live in minnesota.

#30 donk4life

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 08:24 PM

View Post30odd6, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 10:19 PM, said:

go kcuf yourself donk! wow! this is the poker community?? great comment! i live in minnesota.
Every post you make is a refutation of the advice people have been trying to give you. Yes, it's a community, but if you're not going to listen and understand why your poker logic is flawed then why the hell should anyone show you any sympathy? It's clear that you have many leaks in your game, as well your grammar.Read over hands that have been posted in this forum, there are thousands upon thousands of hands that will help you become a better player. If you have hands that you'd think would be worthy of discussion, then post them and your logic behind the plays you make, but if the general consensus says that you're wrong don't go out your way to prove yourself right. Take a step back, realize what you're doing is more than likely wrong, and learn from it. There are some players who have been playing poker for many many years, but that doesn't mean their game is flawless. Those who go out of their way to learn the concepts and strategies, and realize and accept when they are wrong, are those who succeed at poker. From the few posts you've made in this forum, it's clear you're very stubborn, and that is not a good trait to have if you want to be successful at poker.Continually arguing your point when you're obviously in the wrong isn't going to do anyone any good.

View Postakashenk, on 02 August 2012 - 06:44 AM, said:

I don't mind folding out hands we beat.

#31 Tehtoe

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 08:28 PM

View Post30odd6, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 10:19 PM, said:

go kcuf yourself donk! wow! this is the poker community?? great comment! i live in minnesota.
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#32 30odd6

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 08:41 PM

View Postdonk4life, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 10:24 PM, said:

Every post you make is a refutation of the advice people have been trying to give you. Yes, it's a community, but if you're not going to listen and understand why your poker logic is flawed then why the hell should anyone show you any sympathy? It's clear that you have many leaks in your game, as well your grammar.Read over hands that have been posted in this forum, there are thousands upon thousands of hands that will help you become a better player. If you have hands that you'd think would be worthy of discussion, then post them and your logic behind the plays you make, but if the general consensus says that you're wrong don't go out your way to prove yourself right. Take a step back, realize what you're doing is more than likely wrong, and learn from it. There are some players who have been playing poker for many many years, but that doesn't mean their game is flawless. Those who go out of their way to learn the concepts and strategies, and realize and accept when they are wrong, are those who succeed at poker. From the few posts you've made in this forum, it's clear you're very stubborn, and that is not a good trait to have if you want to be successful at poker.Continually arguing your point when you're obviously in the wrong isn't going to do anyone any good.
i apologize to all. yes i am on the stubborn side and maybe its what makes me succeed (all phases of life. when i set my mind to something...i want to know EVERYTHING and WHY). i wrote why i "want" to know more cuz my game was solely based on bluffing and pressure. i am trying to change that and aint doing it quite right, almost but not right. that is why i am on here. i greatly appreciate the help i am getting. if you can look at it through my eyes. i learned on my own and did a pretty good job of it. nobody ever will know all but i sure can use the help. nobody plays perfect. if people dont look at all sides and inside and out, how do you know which is best. i dig too deep sometimes and need to know why???? sorry

#33 GOCUBSGO

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 10:06 PM

View Post30odd6, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 10:41 PM, said:

i apologize to all. yes i am on the stubborn side and maybe its what makes me succeed (all phases of life. when i set my mind to something...i want to know EVERYTHING and WHY). i wrote why i "want" to know more cuz my game was solely based on bluffing and pressure. i am trying to change that and aint doing it quite right, almost but not right. that is why i am on here. i greatly appreciate the help i am getting. if you can look at it through my eyes. i learned on my own and did a pretty good job of it. nobody ever will know all but i sure can use the help. nobody plays perfect. if people dont look at all sides and inside and out, how do you know which is best. i dig too deep sometimes and need to know why???? sorry
I would suggest reading poker books. You are going to get a lot of info without the flaming. These books are geared towards beginners/people looking to improve their game. If you do choose to continue to post on these forums you have to understand that its not personal. People are going to criticize your play and tell you exactly why you failed. If you are going to be stubborn and refuse to listen, then just stop posting. The more you argue with people, the more they are going to flame you and show little interest in adding any real content to your thread.If you want to post hands don't include the results. Just post the scenario up to a certain point (i.e. flop, turn, river) and give us your thinking.This forum is a gold mine of information, full of a lot of really good poker players. You can learn a lot from them if you just set your ego aside and listen.

#34 starfit

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Posted 24 February 2010 - 10:29 PM

View PostGOCUBSGO, on Wednesday, February 24th, 2010, 10:06 PM, said:

This forum is a gold mine of information, full of a lot of really good poker players. You can learn a lot from them if you just set your ego aside and listen.
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#35 Mercury69

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 08:27 AM

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#36 30odd6

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 09:46 AM

i guess my way of discussing is too strong???? if i ask someone how a car runs, and i get...turn the key? that doesnt explain that you need fuel, to be put in a combustion chamber, and a spark to ignite it so as to make compression, so the pistons go up and down and give you torque, to spin the crankshaft, etc. etc. etc. i was looking tooo deep for scientific proof that one way is better than the other. i wasnt trying to argue (if you read the whole thread) i was just looking for answers, and not just being told what to do. sorry, i have a high IQ. that doesnt mean booksmarts, cuz there are a lot of people who are booksmart that cant figure out how to tie thier own shoes. im not sayin anything bad about anyone in this thread, i am the kind of guy who likes to see proof and results. yes, i learned to keep pots small early, and find a better spot to put it in. i still feel 4:1 odds is damn good there, and i get chipped up. i'd get away if nothing comes. i thought the whole object of poker was to get yourself into good situations, and thats where i was. from now on, i'll just listen unless you want my thoughts on it. thx

#37 30odd6

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 10:00 AM

one more question...does daniels teaching of small bal say raise 3xbb+1 per limper??? thx for the answer. and some thoughts to the comment above, if any

#38 Mercury69

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 10:09 AM

Not to be too much of a dick, but seriously, dude, learn to write a little better. It's a serious pain unravelling your crappy structure, punctuation etc...Improve your grammar and spelling and it'll go a long way to improving people's patience in dealing with your questions.
"We had all the momentum. We were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave. So now, less than five years later, you can go up on a steep hill in Las Vegas and look west, and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high-water mark, that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back." —Raoul Duke, Fear And Loathing In Las Vegas

"Those are brave men knocking at the door. Let's go and kill them!" - Tyrion Lannister

#39 30odd6

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 10:28 AM

View Post30odd6, on Thursday, February 25th, 2010, 11:46 AM, said:

i guess my way of discussing is too strong???? if i ask someone how a car runs, and i get...turn the key? that doesnt explain that you need fuel, to be put in a combustion chamber, and a spark to ignite it so as to make compression, so the pistons go up and down and give you torque, to spin the crankshaft, etc. etc. etc. i was looking tooo deep for scientific proof that one way is better than the other. i wasnt trying to argue (if you read the whole thread) i was just looking for answers, and not just being told what to do. sorry, i have a high IQ. that doesnt mean booksmarts, cuz there are a lot of people who are booksmart that cant figure out how to tie thier own shoes. im not sayin anything bad about anyone in this thread, i am the kind of guy who likes to see proof and results. yes, i learned to keep pots small early, and find a better spot to put it in. i still feel 4:1 odds is damn good there, and i get chipped up. i'd get away if nothing comes. i thought the whole object of poker was to get yourself into good situations, and thats where i was. from now on, i'll just listen unless you want my thoughts on it. thx
thx for the heads up mercury. i just start typing and my fingers cant keep up with my mind. i tried to fixit... is it any better?

#40 Mercury69

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 10:50 AM

View Post30odd6, on Thursday, February 25th, 2010, 1:28 PM, said:

thx for the heads up mercury. i just start typing and my fingers cant keep up with my mind. i tried to fixit... is it any better?
I hear ya, dude. Like I said, no offense meant. And, well, no...it's no better, just shorter.
"We had all the momentum. We were riding the crest of a high and beautiful wave. So now, less than five years later, you can go up on a steep hill in Las Vegas and look west, and with the right kind of eyes you can almost see the high-water mark, that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back." —Raoul Duke, Fear And Loathing In Las Vegas

"Those are brave men knocking at the door. Let's go and kill them!" - Tyrion Lannister




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