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Big Draw On The Turn


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#1 nobody610

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Posted 22 January 2010 - 08:39 PM

I want to start by saying that I am brand new to playing Omaha.My big question in this hand is whether I should be pushing this draw facing a raise on the turn. I figured that even if I was up against a set of queens I still had a flush draw, a wrap draw to broadway, and a gutter to a wheel. Thoughts?PokerStars Pot-Limit Omaha, $0.02 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comUTG+1 ($4)MP1 ($2.61)MP2 ($4.13)CO ($1.91)Button ($4.61)Hero (SB) ($2.51)BB ($2.25)UTG ($1)Preflop: Hero is SB with K :5c, A :3h, J :club:, 4 :club:UTG calls $0.02, UTG+1 calls $0.02, MP1 calls $0.02, MP2 calls $0.02, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.01, BB checksFlop: ($0.12) 5 :ts, 2 :4h, 10 :qh (6 players)Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checksTurn: ($0.12) Q :jh (6 players)Hero bets $0.10, BB calls $0.10, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.10, 1 fold, MP2 raises to $0.22, Hero raises to $0.60, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0.38

#2 rrumsey

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Posted 25 January 2010 - 03:04 PM

i would much rather go for a c/r on the turn, we have 2 differnet st8 outs and flush outs, we have a ton of equity, now we need to induce getting money into the middle, check raising should this multiway make this pot huge going into the river, where even if villain turn a set of q's, we still have basically a coinflip. This line did, kinda by accident i think, create a ton of dead money and we have to 3bet MP2's raise, but you need to just pot it at this point, he is saying he has something and he likes his hand, we need to pump up the pot as much as possible. If we miss all our monster draws on the river, well oh well. But think equity, we beat the best possible current holding like 50% of the time here, stay aggro. not horrible, but against better player we are not going to be able to get coldcallers that are folding. LOL to micro PLO for that! It does seem you have the right idea in this hand thou, but bet for the pot. We need to win those extra BB to make up for when we miss. EV EV EV value! but on the right track.
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#3 MaxStPolish

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Posted 26 January 2010 - 05:39 PM

View Postnobody610, on Friday, January 22nd, 2010, 10:39 PM, said:

I want to start by saying that I am brand new to playing Omaha.My big question in this hand is whether I should be pushing this draw facing a raise on the turn. I figured that even if I was up against a set of queens I still had a flush draw, a wrap draw to broadway, and a gutter to a wheel. Thoughts?PokerStars Pot-Limit Omaha, $0.02 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comUTG+1 ($4)MP1 ($2.61)MP2 ($4.13)CO ($1.91)Button ($4.61)Hero (SB) ($2.51)BB ($2.25)UTG ($1)Preflop: Hero is SB with K :5c, A :3h, J :club:, 4 :club:UTG calls $0.02, UTG+1 calls $0.02, MP1 calls $0.02, MP2 calls $0.02, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.01, BB checksFlop: ($0.12) 5 :ts, 2 :4h, 10 :qh (6 players)Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checksTurn: ($0.12) Q :jh (6 players)Hero bets $0.10, BB calls $0.10, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.10, 1 fold, MP2 raises to $0.22, Hero raises to $0.60, 2 folds, MP2 calls $0.38
I disagree with you nearly entirely rumsey.I would bet this out has you have like 35% nut outs with some addt'l made hands. Well worth a turn bet. You build a pot by betting. Especially when it's this small. Not by checking out of position hoping to raise, when there are 4 players and you have a lot of nothing, but a good percentage of dreams. You get two floaters and then a near min raise shows up, I would elect to call this, as 95% of the time this brings both floaters along for the ride. You have fantastic equity here and with a monster draw the more players the better.The only reason I don't 3 bet this is because you are going to most likely cut out the two floaters, and I don't see much F/E from this villain. The only way this plays for you I think is if you are getting implied odds that you will get called on the river the majority of the time.Additionally you are out of position, so you are dead to rights when you brick the river. You are either going to check/fold, giving away a good chunk of money, or fire out a blind bluff which will get called often here to be profitable.In conclusion, call this min raise, let the limpers stick around and let's see this river. I would even check a lot of made hands here with three players behind, as 2nd nut hands aren't going to be calling here to not try and get value.p.s. the only time I raise here is if I feel strong that the min raiser is on a similar draw, then i will 3 bet to isolate, planning on shoving any river to either bluff as a made hand, or if I make good.




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