8 replies to this topic

[bluff2much]

I lost the last 5 tournaments with the best hand on the flop and/or turn, only to get out drawn on the river. 3 Times I have the set, and get drawn out w/ a flush. two pair, only 2 have someone else catch a better 2 pair. Flop a straight, to eventually loose to a full house. Most of the time, I am the one putting the chips in.My question is, should I be betting smaller amounts, knowing that the flush draw will call my large bet? Or that the set may catch a full house. Should I wait until the river to evaluate on whether or not I have the best hand?I feel like I want to get rid of the crappy draws, but at the same time, I don't want to loose my chips when someone catches a lucky hand.Thanks for your help.Jason

[Smasharoo]

Well, couple of things.One, why wouldn't you want to get as many chips as possible in while you are a big favorite to win the hand?Two don't play short term results, play solid theory. People hitting flush draws against your sets happens 35% of the time they draw to them. People hitting full houses or quads with flopped sets happens about as often.Don't worry about it. It's just holdem. No one's going to pay off your set with a busted flush draw on a big river bet, are they? Get the chips in the middle when you have the best hand and they are willing to put them in play.

[Chip_and_a_Chair]

Smasharoo is absolutely right. Stay aggressive. If you get your money in the pot while you are the favorite, you'll turn a profit over the longhaul... provided you don't adjust your play and become more passive for fear of draws.I just lost $400 last night in the situation you just described - and $400 is a lot to me. Had pocket kings, raised to 4x BB with a loose player on my left. He called. Flop was 7d 2d Kc. I pushed all-in. He flipped over 10d 8d. Caught his flush on the river. Lost my buy-in. Frustrating? Yes. Wondering why he would call a large preflop raise with a 10 8 when I have a tight table image? Yes. But pushing with the (temporary) nuts was the right play, and I would do it again in a heartbeat, even if I lost 10 times in a row in the same situation. Over the longrun, the odds will tip back in your favor. Get your money in the middle while the suckers are feeling saucy enough to pay for their draws.

[CoranMoran]

I have heard many pros state they they don't mind accumulating a bunch of bad beats in a night... because that simply meant that they were getting their money into the pot with the best hand.This is true.Everytime you take a beat, it tells you that you did something right.Recognize this and continue to gamble in these situation.Step 1: Know your odds and recognize that your strong hands are favored over most draws. Step 2: Trust the odds and gamble as many chips as possible when they are in your favor.Step 3: Rake in the long term profits.--cnm

[bluff2much]

I didn't mean to whine about the whole bad beat thing, but i was suriously considering changing my style of play, instead I will make a small adjustment. Thank you all for your help. It seems like everyone agrees, make the opposing palyers pay for their draws. Thanks again....Jason

[Chip_and_a_Chair]

What do you mean by "make a small adjustment?" If your money is in the pot with the best hand and you force your opponent to draw for his life, what adjustment do you need?

[wrto4556]

bluff2much said:

My question is, should I be betting smaller amounts, knowing that the flush draw will call my large bet?  Or that the set may catch a full house. Should I wait until the river to evaluate on whether or not I have the best hand?

You almost made a serious mistake. When I read that above quote, my eyes got real big and I subconciously started shaking my head "no". You want to get as much money in the pot with the best hand, like everyone else said. That's why it's stressed to be aggressive. When you have the best hand, bet like you have nothing to lose...because, in fact, you don't. You may lose to the flush one time, but 4 times you will win, so you dont lose at all...you win. Don't ever slow down when you have the best hand. I had AA beaten by K6s the other day in a no-limit game. Lost the $100 I sat down with, but in theory, I didn't lose a dime. If I keep putting myself in these situations I will make money. period.

[bluff2much]

By small adjustment, what I was thinking is that I could limit my bet to a certain percentage of chips on the flop, when I flop a solid hand like a set. Of course, If i'm short stacked I'm all in. And if not a percentage of my chips, perhaps a percentage of the pot, perhaps 2 to 3 times the pot. or If I'm heads up, should i bet a certain amount of their chips. I guess its a question of how much to bet, but it sounds like there are to many considerations.I rarely put all in my chips in unless of course I have the nuts. Keep in mind that I've only been player for a little over a year, and really only played limit, So I kind of had that attitude of wanting to avoid draws. No limit is farely new to me.

[Smasharoo]

By small adjustment, what I was thinking is that I could limit my bet to a certain percentage of chips on the flop, when I flop a solid hand like a set. That's good way to make sure you don't get money in with best hand. Think of it this way.If you see flops of 777 9 times in a day are you going to raise with 72 offsuit the next day?