12 replies to this topic

[Kataklysmos]

Not a lot of information on this person. It's still fairly early. I dont remember him showing down any weak hands.My first instinct here was to fold as I figured I was behind but then opt'd to see a flop and re-eval after the flop. AQ+ JJ+.. I see all these as possibles.But typical people like to slowplay made sets these days but with the wet board texture considering calling hands that may be against him, i.e s00ted cards or AQ, AT, etc., I would figure that he would bet more than a little over half the pot to close out odds of someone chasing. So my OOP check which was originally meant to be a c/f, turned into a c/r as his bet leads me to believe that he has QQ or AK/AQ/AJ or AA and doesn't necessarily have a "made" hand. I thought that the shove would let him know he was behind and was hoping if he was on a draw himself that he wouldn't call. These turbo Steps sometime require large amounts of aggression.Eval this play, and I will even accept a PF fold for an answer as that may have been the proper play. Was a great, lucky flop. As played, I don't think I did anything wrong but I'm interested in responses.http://www.pokerhand.org/?4301270PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $75+$7 Tournament, 15/30 Blinds (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comsaw flop | saw showdownSB (t2105)BB (t1430)UTG (t1500)UTG+1 (t1230)MP1 (t1530)MP2 (t1370)MP3 (t1470)Hero (CO) (t1280)Button (t1585)Hero's M: 28.44Preflop: Hero is CO with J, K5 folds, Hero bets t90, Button raises to t250, 2 folds, Hero calls t160Flop: (t545) J, 3, K (2 players)Hero checks, Button bets t300, Hero raises to t1030 (All-In), Button calls t730Turn: (t2605) 10 (2 players, 1 all-in)River: (t2605) 8 (2 players, 1 all-in)Total pot: t2605Results:Button had A, A (one pair, Aces).Hero had J, K (two pair, Kings and Jacks).Outcome: Hero won t2605

[SwolyswoND]

I'm so confused.Yes, first off, this is like the world's easiest fold PF. KJo is the nut-low against a 3bet, absent a read. Think about what you listed his range as, and then figure out your equity against that range holding KJo, then also remember you will be OOP. It's not pretty.As played to the flop, how on God's green Earth are you considering a c/f? What more did you want to see when you called PF? I'm sorry you didnt hit KJJ, but good lord man...I don't understand how you intended to c/f but then decided to c/RAI because he bet. How were you planning to c/f without him betting? And why did you want him to fold if he had QQ or a draw? Why did you want him to fold ANYTHING here? You're behind exactly TWO combinations of hands here. Just remember that. 2 combos out of 2500 or so.

[HighwayStar]

All of the above.Fold preflop. CRAI on flop is def best.

[melaskins]

Kat, your assignment for to today is to read the first response to your post about a dozen times. After that go watch the videos at FTR by bjsaust and givememyleg on small stakes tourneys. In this hand, the tournament has just started and you are already down to 1280. Combine that with the fact that you are even willing to play KJo and it is pretty obvious that you are probably playing a lot of marginal to weak hands. You may have lost the 220 in a good hand and be on tilt right now but you simply shouldn't be playing KJo. You got lucky in this hand and good for you but without that luck you are down to about 1000 chips and have one foot out the door.

[Biff Goods]

Kataklysmos, on Sunday, May 31st, 2009, 12:38 AM, said:

his bet leads me to believe that he has QQ or AK/AQ/AJ or AA and doesn't necessarily have a "made" hand.

Lol at you thinking your opponent thinks these are not "made" hands and will fold to a flop bluff shove.

[jmbreslin]

I can't say anything that hasn't already been said. There are several flaws in your reasoning; read the responses over and over again until you understand what those flaws are.

[TrueAce13]

Echo what everyone says a lot of mistakes made in this hand

[thavinny9]

K-J is a hand you can raise with in late position but FOLD if you're 3-bet...much more easy to fold if you're 3-bet by the only guy that have position on you on the table...you're forced to play a marginal hand out of position...

[kkot]

SwolyswoND, on Sunday, May 31st, 2009, 1:25 AM, said:

I'm so confused.Yes, first off, this is like the world's easiest fold PF. KJo is the nut-low against a 3bet, absent a read. Think about what you listed his range as, and then figure out your equity against that range holding KJo, then also remember you will be OOP. It's not pretty.As played to the flop, how on God's green Earth are you considering a c/f? What more did you want to see when you called PF? I'm sorry you didnt hit KJJ, but good lord man...I don't understand how you intended to c/f but then decided to c/RAI because he bet. How were you planning to c/f without him betting? And why did you want him to fold if he had QQ or a draw? Why did you want him to fold ANYTHING here? You're behind exactly TWO combinations of hands here. Just remember that. 2 combos out of 2500 or so.

I completely agree with all of this.I could argue for an open fold preflop, but I think opening it is fine. Calling the 3bet is really bad. I like a 4bet way more than a call.

[tbrick412]

I dont mind opening from CO with KJo honestly. Fold to the 3-bet though. As played c/r all in the flop 100% of the time. just sucks that he had KK? or JJ?edit nvmd didnt see the results. nh

[tbrick412]

also, put us in villains shoes here. was our reraise to 250 a bit to small? I'm making it 300-330ish here but thats just me.

[aggie3]

melaskins, on Sunday, May 31st, 2009, 6:11 AM, said:

Kat, your assignment for to today is to read the first response to your post about a dozen times. After that go watch the videos at FTR by bjsaust and givememyleg on small stakes tourneys. In this hand, the tournament has just started and you are already down to 1280. Combine that with the fact that you are even willing to play KJo and it is pretty obvious that you are probably playing a lot of marginal to weak hands. You may have lost the 220 in a good hand and be on tilt right now but you simply shouldn't be playing KJo. You got lucky in this hand and good for you but without that luck you are down to about 1000 chips and have one foot out the door.

This

[DonkSlayer]

tbrick412, on Wednesday, June 3rd, 2009, 3:09 PM, said:

also, put us in villains shoes here. was our reraise to 250 a bit to small? I'm making it 300-330ish here but thats just me.

Prob not for AA if there aren't any real loose players behind you.