akishore/wily heads-up hand #3

[akishore 0]

PL HE, $0.05/0.10 blinds (live)akishore: $15ishwily: $15ishwily is button/SB.pre-flop:wily raises $0.10, akishore calls.flop: K 2 2 ($0.40)akishore bets $0.40, wily calls.turn: 4 ($1.20)akishore bets $1.20, wily calls.river: K ($3.60)akishore checks, wily bets $2.50, akishore calls.guess the hands.aseem

[gobears 0]

Akishore:AAWily:K10

[econ_tim 0]

Yang has K 3 You have 2 6

[Dubey 1,035]

I doubt either has a King, or two, to be honest. hmm.Akishore: 66Wiley: tough one, I am thinking maybe JQd. He calls the bet post flop because he knows you are following up with your preflop raise, and he has position on you, so he wants to see hwo you act on the turn. Hits a flush draw on the turn, so calls again. You check the river and he tries to steal the pot by representing Kings. I can't put him on a King because he would have re-raised the flop, he can't put you on a 2 when you raised preflop (or can he?)

[akishore 0]

I doubt either has a King, or two, to be honest. hmm.Akishore: 66Wiley: tough one, I am thinking maybe JQd. He calls the bet post flop because he knows you are following up with your preflop raise, and he has position on you, so he wants to see hwo you act on the turn. Hits a flush draw on the turn, so calls again. You check the river and he tries to steal the pot by representing Kings. I can't put him on a King because he would have re-raised the flop, he can't put you on a 2 when you raised preflop (or can he?)

i didn't raise pre-flop, he did. i pulled a stop-and-go.aseem

[Dubey 1,035]

oops, yeah. hmm.Well, in that case, I'll say:Akishore: 2 5 clubsWiley: hmm, Wiley might have a king here. But I am going to say 88, or AQ diamonds. Although I'm not sure he can justify the flop call with the latter. He hits the flush draw on the turn, calls. when the kings pair and you check, he figures his Ace high mght be good, so he semi-bluffs the pot, hoping to steal.

[Kendren 1]

Him: K4You: (hmmm...) 22!

[akishore 0]

you guys give us too much credit. aseem

[akishore 0]

akishore: Q 4 wily: 6 3 i promise this was a very logical (and very psychological) hand.aseem

[econ_tim 0]

All I can say is keep playing logically and psychologically and I will take all you $ in tomorrow's MTT. :-)

[Mr Monkey 0]

akishore: Q 4 wily: 6 3 i promise this was a very logical (and very psychological) hand.aseem

i read the other hands also. the only thing that seems logical to me is that their are 2 players playing penny stakes who really dont care if they lose and are just playing for fun. to say or try to insinuate that their is any other logical or psyhchological reasons for the way these hands were played is nonsense

[akishore 0]

i read the other hands also. the only thing that seems logical to me is that their are 2 players playing penny stakes who really dont care if they lose and are just playing for fun. to say or try to insinuate that their is any other logical or psyhchological reasons for the way these hands were played is nonsense

it's easy to assume that, but i'll give both of our thoughts soon. this was an excellent example of strong, psychological heads-up play on a higher level of thinking that goes beyond the cards, and i guarantee we were both playing competitively and realistically.aseem

[Mr Monkey 0]

"higher level of thinking" u guys must have been smoking the good stuffplease explain soon cause im tired and want to read this

[akishore 0]

"higher level of thinking" u guys must have been smoking the good stuffplease explain soon cause im tired and want to read this

okay, give me a couple of minutes.aseem

[akishore 0]

PL HE, $0.05/0.10 blinds (live)akishore: $15ishwily: $15ishwily is button/SB.pre-flop: akishore is BB with Q 4 wily raises $0.10, akishore calls.i had noticed that he often min-raised with rags since i folded a decent amount of time to these types of raises. i would fold if i had rags since i was out of position with weak cards, but after he min-raised so often with rags, i felt i could try to play his cards rather than mine.flop: K 2 2 ($0.40)akishore bets $0.40, wily calls.wily knows that one of my biggest pet peeves in PL HE is betting the pot. i almost never do it--i consider it akin to pushing all-in in NL HE unnecessarily. it also makes the later streets MUCH harder to play since the pot is bigger and you're tied to the pot more (pot manipulation), and since you often bet the pot with vulnerable hands, it just screws you over. anyway, not something worth discussing right now.so with the paired board (less likely that he hit it statistically), i figure i can take a stab at it. he either hit this flop hard (a 2) or has rags, so if i represent any part of this board (king or 2), he might fold. since i never bet pot and wily knows it, i bet the pot here and make it clear by saying "pot". i hope to represent either a protecting king (thinking that yang might have raised with a mid pocket pair) or a fastplayed trip 2's.wily thinks for a second and calls. i realize that my pot bet has sparked his interest. i'm not sure how to continue, but since he's curious, i like the idea of potting it again on any turn card and seeing how he responds. if he raises, i strongly believe that the raise will be a bluff thinking that my pot bet is meaningless. so, if he raises, i will reraise strongly representing fastplayed trip 2's that successfully trapped wily. if he calls or reraises, i shut down immediately as he has successfully slowplayed trip 2's.turn: 4 ($1.20)akishore bets $1.20, wily calls.i pot it, and again, he thinks for a second and calls. right now, i'm not sure if he's decided to call down out of nothing but curiousity, but the board now has two draws possible. since i put him on rags earlier, i figure that either he has not improved (and has decided to call me down out of curiousity), he hit the 4 for a pair, or he has picked up a diamond or straight draw.fortunately, i hit a pair, so i actually believe i might be good here whether i pick up the pot or not.river: K ($3.60)akishore checks, wily bets $2.50, akishore calls.this is a very interesting card. i don't feel that wily would have played a pair of king so passively on either the flop or the turn, even despite my suspicious pot betting. he might be slowplaying trip 2's, but he doesn't slowplay past the turn in almost any case (rightly so). if had the 2, he would have raised me on the turn. rags would be no good here against my 4's. any draw he picked up on the turn would have also missed.since this is PL, i don't want to bet and face a big bet. i decide to check, representing either a scared 2-x or a check-raising K-x. wily thinks for a while and puts out a big bet, and i feel that it's a bluff. why? wily's value bets are usually either small (he calls them "sick value bets" as he bets out 1/8 of the pot :-) ) or near-pot-sized (when he decides to fastplay trip 7's against my aggression).he also sometimes misses value bets on the river when he feels he got counterfeited in some way, and i believe he would check behind with a 2 here, fearing a river check-raise (not sarcastic--he knows check-raises are one of my favorite moves, and he knows that i won't be scared to do it on the river if i believe strongly that he will bet but fold to a bet).so with this large bet, i think for a while and feel that my 4 is good against any missed turn draw or any curious rags hoping to call me down (who now saw an opportunity to take the big pot without a showdown). i debate for a while and say out loud that i hate making this kind of call. his smile seemed to fade (refer to caro's tells--genuine smiles versus fake ones), signalling that he didn't want the call. since i didn't think he would bet here with a 2, i figured the only way i was beat was if he bet here with a mid pocket pair, but again, i felt he would check behind with a mid pocket pair.so i called, and my kings and fours beat his kings and twos with 6 kicker (he had 6 3 for a gutshot draw on the turn).aseem

[akishore 0]

anybody care to discuss?aseem

[TheIceman05 0]

akishore: Q 4  wily: 6 3  i promise this was a very logical (and very psychological) hand.aseem

i read the other hands also. the only thing that seems logical to me is that their are 2 players playing penny stakes who really dont care if they lose and are just playing for fun. to say or try to insinuate that their is any other logical or psyhchological reasons for the way these hands were played is nonsense

Someone's got egg on his face.oooooooooooooooooooooooh! Snap!Right on target again, Aseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeem. Fun analysis, and fun post. Ice

[Guest]

anybody care to discuss?aseem

Hehe, at first I thought you were just being crazy calling with Q high! I missed you paired the 4. In that case, it was a very nicely played hand, and well done.Zara

[Guest]

P.S. This is why HU matches have some crazy variance (especially big bet HU like PL and NL). Any two cards should see a flop in limit, and nearly any two in PL. After that you have to get in your opponents head and hope you're right with your analysis of what they have. Especially in limit, you call down a lot with A and K high as they win enough to show a profit based on pot size so it comes down to who gets luckier in the short term (and who can extract more when they get lucky in the long term.)Zara

[Mr Monkey 0]

akishore: Q 4 wily: 6 3 i promise this was a very logical (and very psychological) hand.aseem

i read the other hands also. the only thing that seems logical to me is that their are 2 players playing penny stakes who really dont care if they lose and are just playing for fun. to say or try to insinuate that their is any other logical or psyhchological reasons for the way these hands were played is nonsense

Someone's got egg on his face.oooooooooooooooooooooooh! Snap!Right on target again, Aseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeem. Fun analysis, and fun post. Ice

Egg on my face, LOL. Im right Ice. The stakes had everything to do with the way these hands were thought out and played. Aseems analysis was good and i liked reading it.