14 replies to this topic

[wrto4556]

Villan is my arch nemisis. :wink: 5/10 (heads up)Preflop: I get delt T ,5 in the BB.Button raises, I call.Flop: (4sb) J ,2 ,3 I check, Button bets, I call.Turn: (3BB) 5 I bet...Anyone like that line?

[Absolute]

duh

[wrto4556]

I could also check/raise, check/call with the intention of leading the river, or open fold...ass.

[Absolute]

wrto4556 said:

I could also check/raise, check/call with the intention of leading the river, or open fold...ass.

the duh was in reference to the obvious open fold

[MrNiceGuy]

I'm not very good heads-up, but I think I would fold on the flop - is this too weak? I'm figuring you're behind any hand except two middle cards, with only 6 immediate outs, none of which are certain to be good.I'd probably call preflop against all but the most weak-passive of opponents.

[wrto4556]

I guess noone is going to give me a serious response so I will say what I was thinking.I may or may not have the best hand...it's not really the point. The point of the turn is how I want to set him up in later hands. If I check/raise it will keep him from pulling continuation bets with two UI cards in later hands. If I lead, he knows that I lead the turn with marginal holdings (including draws) and will set him up for a 3-bet later when I have a monster. Or, I could check/call and keep him from bluffing in later hands.Which do you choose?

[Absolute]

wrto4556 said:

I guess noone is going to give me a serious response so I will say what I was thinking.I may or may not have the best hand...it's not really the point. The point of the turn is how I want to set him up in later hands. If I check/raise it will keep him from pulling continuation bets with two UI cards in later hands. If I lead, he knows that I lead the turn with marginal holdings (including draws) and will set him up for a 3-bet later when I have a monster. Or, I could check/call and keep him from bluffing in later hands.Which do you choose?

actually, that last one

[wrto4556]

MrNiceGuy said:

I'm not very good heads-up, but I think I would fold on the flop - is this too weak? I'm figuring you're behind any hand except two middle cards, with only 6 immediate outs, none of which are certain to be good.I'd probably call preflop against all but the most weak-passive of opponents.

No offesnse, but I would kill you heads up. :-) Great cards for me on the turn are:any (I can win the pot with a semi-bluff).any baby (I can win the pot with a semi-bluff)Any TAny 5Also, calling the flop is mandatory no matter what two cards I have. It's a way to keep from being run over.

[wrto4556]

also, betting this turn sets me up for semi-bluffs later!EDIT: **Check/raising gets my better hands payed off, too because he knows I will check/raise with marginal hands.**

[wrto4556]

Absolute said:

wrto4556 said:

I guess noone is going to give me a serious response so I will say what I was thinking.I may or may not have the best hand...it's not really the point. The point of the turn is how I want to set him up in later hands. If I check/raise it will keep him from pulling continuation bets with two UI cards in later hands. If I lead, he knows that I lead the turn with marginal holdings (including draws) and will set him up for a 3-bet later when I have a monster. Or, I could check/call and keep him from bluffing in later hands.Which do you choose?

actually, that last one

why?

[Absolute]

wrto4556 said:

Absolute said:

wrto4556 said:

I guess noone is going to give me a serious response so I will say what I was thinking.I may or may not have the best hand...it's not really the point. The point of the turn is how I want to set him up in later hands. If I check/raise it will keep him from pulling continuation bets with two UI cards in later hands. If I lead, he knows that I lead the turn with marginal holdings (including draws) and will set him up for a 3-bet later when I have a monster. Or, I could check/call and keep him from bluffing in later hands.Which do you choose?

actually, that last one

why?

this is your arch nemesis.he is going to bet the river UI.he might fold this turn or call and fold the river UI.

[wrto4556]

Don't think about this hand. Think about hands that will occur later. What does betting, check/calling, and check/raising accomplish later.Sort of higher level thinking, if you will.Im trying to get into his head.

[Absolute]

wrto4556 said:

Don't think about this hand. Think about hands that will occur later. What does betting, check/calling, and check/raising accomplish later.Sort of higher level thinking, if you will.Im trying to get into his head.

if you check/call this pair, he is goin to stop bluffing big streets.he is also going to second guess later aggression with marginal hands that have you beat.see where im comin from?i think it slows him down without pissing him off.unless you want to piss him off...

[MrNiceGuy]

wrto4556 said:

No offesnse, but I would kill you heads up. :-)

I have no doubt about that :-) I'm trying to get better at heads-up postflop situations as I move up (from the microlimits toward the low limits).

wrto4556 said:

Great cards for me on the turn are:any (I can win the pot with a semi-bluff).any baby (I can win the pot with a semi-bluff)Any TAny 5Also, calling the flop is mandatory no matter what two cards I have. It's a way to keep from being run over.

I agree that you don't want to fold under these circumstances often, but I was thinking that this might be one of those times where it's warranted? A semibluff on the turn is probably overall profitable once you have the chance, but do you think it's profitable enough to justify drawing to get that chance?Anyway, having proven that I don't know what I'm talking about - I like leading the turn here, because it's an "honest" bet that, as you said, could set you up for semibluffs (or even pure bluffs) later on.

[monoatomic]

wrto4556 said:

Im trying to get into his head.

You can try and get into his head, but heads up action one time you lead out on a marginal hand isn't going to stick out in his mind more so then any other play you could pull here.Heads up isn't the same as a full ring table, or even a short hand table. You shouldn't be trying to use one pot as an information send to help you out in later hands. If you did something consistently enough for it to be noticeable then maybe, but one hand isn't going to sway someone one way or the other.I think a check raise though, would be a better avenue to persue in this situation. Most likely your 5's are best right now and I think it would send a better message (if that's what your going for) that you are willing to put in a raise with 2nd pair to his advances. The other thing that the check raise is puts you in the drivers seat and not him. If you lead out and he smells weakness he's going to raise you. Then what? Do you fold thinking you are beat here or do you call/check/call down the river? I think it would be better to be in the position of power in this hand which is what a check raise would do.