Aq 4 Way Pot

[kkot 0]

I just got to the table, but the blinds seem loose.--------------------HAND #1--------------------Full Tilt, $1/$2 Limit Hold'em Cash Game, 6 PlayersHand History Converter by StoxpokerPre-Flop: Hero is MP with A QUTG calls, Hero raises, CO folds, BTN folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG callsFlop: (8 SB) 4 3 K (4 players)SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checksTurn: (4 BB) K (4 players)SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, SB calls, BB folds, UTG callsRiver: (7 BB) Q (3 players)SB checks, UTG checks, Hero betsDoes anybody cbet here?Anybody not bet the turn?I think the river is a clear value bet.

[DinkDonk 1]

With a flop as dry as this, I'm probably c-betting here, but I think it's close. I don't mind a check.On the turn, I think it's a bet for value/protection. You're going to get calls from hands like A5, A2, any gutshot, some A highs, etc. and there is enough money in the pot that it's probably worth more to protect it than to induce bluffs.As you said, river is a very very easy value bet.I have no problem with how you played it. The trickiest street is the flop imo. It's tough to know which boards to c-bet in these multiway pots.

[Whatever 1]

Blah I always c-bet there. Not saying it's correct. I would bet the flop and check behind on the turn. Pretty much opposite I guess. And yea I'd always bet the river there.

[CoranMoran 0]

I play every street the exact same.

Blah I always c-bet there.

Always making cont-bets against 3 opponents is a serious leak.

With a flop as dry as this, I'm probably c-betting here

This flop isn't dry.Straight and Flush Draws are both possible.The key is to always remember who we are playing against.If we had 3-bet preflop over an opening raiser, then it would be unlikely that our opponent(s) would have coordinated with those small straight cards.They woul likely have pocket pairs or big cards.But in this hand, we are against- a limper (who could have anything)- the blinds (who could defend with anything)Their range is huge, and they could certainly have some little cards and like this board.So against these opponents, that flop is very wet.I don't think a continuation bet here is profitable.--CM

[DinkDonk 1]

I play every street the exact same.Always making cont-bets against 3 opponents is a serious leak.This flop isn't dry.Straight and Flush Draws are both possible.The key is to always remember who we are playing against.If we had 3-bet preflop over an opening raiser, then it would be unlikely that our opponent(s) would have coordinated with those small straight cards.They woul likely have pocket pairs or big cards.But in this hand, we are against- a limper (who could have anything)- the blinds (who could defend with anything)Their range is huge, and they could certainly have some little cards and like this board.So against these opponents, that flop is very wet.I don't think a continuation bet here is profitable.--CM

You may be correct in the last part (I didn't analyze this very in depth), but I disagree with the first part. I understand that flush draws are possible and that is certainly a factor, but what straight draws are in their range that have any sort of decent equity? 56 is it and usually heavily weighted towards 56s. A2 and A5 are possible, but we are in excellent shape vs. them and they are probably not semibluffing the flop. Most of the time on this flop, we're only unhappy when an opponent has a K.

[CoranMoran 0]

I disagree with the first part. I understand that flush draws are possible and that is certainly a factor, but what straight draws are in their range that have any sort of decent equity?

If we agree that our opponents' ranges in this hand are huge, then there are a bunch of random Straight Draws that are possible.Yes, only 54 is a strong draw, but there are numerous funky Gut Shots out there.And the key here is that anyone with even a Gut Shot is- not going to fold the flop- has about as much equity in this hand as we do!

Most of the time on this flop, we're only unhappy when an opponent has a K.

If I thought we could get lesser pairs to fold, then I would agree with this.But if an opponent is going to be playing little cards in the first place (and we know they often do!), then they are certainly not going to fold them when they connect.So I am unhappy with much more than just the KMy thoughts:I'm not terribly concerned with what equity my opponents have.Because I feel that we are playing against opponents who don't even accurately take this into account when making decisions.My focus here is our equity.In general, we bet for a couple of reasons.- Bluff- ValueDo either of these apply here?- Bluffing means better hands are folding.But we know that our opponents at this level are never folding this flop if they have any piece.So we can't force out a better hand.- Can we realistically bet here for Value?If Villains' ranges are huge in this hand, then between the three of them, there is a solid chance one of them has already paired up.It is also very possible that someone began the hand with a small pair too.In either case, we are behind and thus can not value bet.But an important question here is whether or not we should Value Bet if our hand is still best.Even if everyone else missed the flop too, our equity is still not that great.As mentioned, we don't even have significantly favorable equity against weak draws.So unless all three opponents whiffed the flop completes (which is highly unlikely), a bet has slim to no value with our Ace High.Point: When you combine the significant chance that we are behind, to the fact that we don't have great equity even when ahead, I can't really find any reason to bet.--cm

[checkymcfold 0]

CM, we can also bet for two cards for one small bet instead of one big bet. also, in a 4-way pot, a king is a lot more likely to donkbet into us than in a sh pot, so i think we achieve that pretty often here. tbh, i think it's pretty close to a complete wash whether cbetting is good here or not.

[CoranMoran 0]

CM, we can also bet for two cards for one small bet instead of one big bet.

The free card play.But it is so hard to pull that off with 3 opponents.It is so much more profitable to use this play if we at least have a decent draw.

also, in a 4-way pot, a king is a lot more likely to donkbet into us than in a sh pot, so i think we achieve that pretty often here.

The King is waiting to check-raise us.Don't give him the chance.--cm

[checkymcfold 0]

maybe we play in different sorts of games or have different sorts of images, but in my experience, betting for two cards works significantly over half the time if we get checked to by all three villains. i'd say people are going for a turn raise at least as often as they're going to c/r the flop.