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The Bush Third Term Party Line


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#21 copernicus

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 07:50 PM

View PostPotomophobia, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 8:38 PM, said:

We have the biggest IEDs in the world. They are called Nuclear (NOT NUCULAR) weapons. Learn the definition of IED.Ever been outside the US for more than a tourist jaunt? Ever seen life outside America? No never. Except for business trips to Saudi Arabia, Germany, Brazil and the UK that is. Ever wonder what it's like to have to deal with the most powerful country in the world ruled by a man who cannot pronounce the name of the weapons he controls? It is a very common pronucniation and even raising it shows the shallowness of your arguments.Ever wondered what it is like to watch said country invade another country based on lies never happened. and call it a Crusade? Ever been in the military? Ever fought in a war? Yes, Viet Nam, moron. Ever watched men die? Yes, plenty and saved a few too as a medic.Didn't think so. Evidence of your thinking ability.

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#22 wakiki

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 07:56 PM

I agree with most of your post, except for the idea that McCain needs to shake things up by bringing back Wright and Ayers. This would be so transparent that it would disgust people, especially with the current economic crisis. I think that tactic would backfire horribly. I do agree with you that McCain needs to shake things up again; that just isn't the way to go about it, imo.I find your enjoyment of the "game" aspect amusing, Dr. Negreanu. I tend to shrug my shoulders at the benign stuff like McCain putting his campaign "on hold," but was disgusted when he painted Obama's "lipstick on a pig" as attacking Palin. (And this is coming from a McCain supporter)
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#23 copernicus

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 08:29 PM

View Postwakiki, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 8:56 PM, said:

I find your enjoyment of the "game" aspect amusing, Dr. Negreanu. I tend to shrug my shoulders at the benign stuff like McCain putting his campaign "on hold," but was disgusted when he painted Obama's "lipstick on a pig" as attacking Palin. (And this is coming from a McCain supporter)
Why were you disgusted, when, based on their reaction, the people at that speech thought it was an attack on Palin.
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#24 Potomophobia

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 08:37 PM

We have the biggest IEDs in the world. They are called Nuclear (NOT NUCULAR) weapons. Learn the definition of IED.Ever been outside the US for more than a tourist jaunt? Ever seen life outside America? No never. Except for business trips to Saudi Arabia, Germany, Brazil and the UK that is. Ever wonder what it's like to have to deal with the most powerful country in the world ruled by a man who cannot pronounce the name of the weapons he controls? It is a very common pronucniation and even raising it shows the shallowness of your arguments.Ever wondered what it is like to watch said country invade another country based on lies never happened. and call it a Crusade? Ever been in the military? Ever fought in a war? Yes, Viet Nam, moron. Ever watched men die? Yes, plenty and saved a few too as a medic.Didn't think so. Evidence of your thinking ability.Improvised Explosive Devices. Pardon me if consider a nuclear weapon improvised. All of our explosive devices are improvised.Business trips? Where and for what in any of them?Nucular is not a common pronunciation (btw...your spelling sucks). It is a common mispronunciation.Never happened? You truly are delusional. And if you had ever been in Nam, you would have put that first for seeing life outside America before your bogus business trips.You are a fraud. And a bad one at that. I also find you to be a particularly odious individual for claiming to be a medic.But then I would expect nothing less from the "win at all costs lie about anything and everything" republicans.You are the worst of what America has to offer.
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#25 strategy

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 08:40 PM

View Postcopernicus, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 11:29 PM, said:

Why were you disgusted, when, based on their reaction, the people at that speech thought it was an attack on Palin.
he's a lawyer. his wording is never an accident. I don't think there's any chance he wasn't trying to evoke at least some of those feelings.also, I don't think it's possible to get that high up in politics without making a few deals with the devil. mccain just gets a worse rap because anyone with a brain can see that he sold his soul with an otherwise useless palin.
QUOTE (ShakeZuma @ Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011, 4:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
seriously though, with that grammar it's really like, I mean it doesn't bother me as much that she gets beat, you know?


#26 copernicus

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 08:41 PM

View PostPotomophobia, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 9:37 PM, said:

We have the biggest IEDs in the world. They are called Nuclear (NOT NUCULAR) weapons. Learn the definition of IED.Ever been outside the US for more than a tourist jaunt? Ever seen life outside America? No never. Except for business trips to Saudi Arabia, Germany, Brazil and the UK that is. Ever wonder what it's like to have to deal with the most powerful country in the world ruled by a man who cannot pronounce the name of the weapons he controls? It is a very common pronucniation and even raising it shows the shallowness of your arguments.Ever wondered what it is like to watch said country invade another country based on lies never happened. and call it a Crusade? Ever been in the military? Ever fought in a war? Yes, Viet Nam, moron. Ever watched men die? Yes, plenty and saved a few too as a medic.Didn't think so. Evidence of your thinking ability.Improvised Explosive Devices. Pardon me if consider a nuclear weapon improvised. All of our explosive devices are improvised.Another word you dont know the definitions of. Business trips? Where and for what in any of them? I told you where. I helped design the Saudi Arabian and Brazilian Social Security systems and the others were meetings on ex-pat compensation packages. Nucular is not a common pronunciation (btw...your spelling sucks). It is a common mispronunciation. Tell it to a half dozen physics professors Ive had.Never happened? You truly are delusional. If you can prove a single lie youve done more than every journalist would love to be able to do. Youre the delusional one.And if you had ever been in Nam, you would have put that first for seeing life outside America before your bogus business trips.You are a fraud. And a bad one at that. I also find you to be a particularly odious individual for claiming to be a medic.But then I would expect nothing less from the "win at all costs lie about anything and everything" republicans.You are the worst of what America has to offer.
As to the rest, put up your roll and Ill put up my discharge papers and medals. Tell then, a sincere go **** yourself.
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#27 strategy

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 08:53 PM

View Postcopernicus, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 11:41 PM, said:

As to the rest, put up your roll and Ill put up my discharge papers and medals. Tell then, a sincere go **** yourself.
it's viral, I tells ya!
QUOTE (ShakeZuma @ Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011, 4:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
seriously though, with that grammar it's really like, I mean it doesn't bother me as much that she gets beat, you know?


#28 85suited

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 09:08 PM

View PostDanielNegreanu, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 9:00 PM, said:

I would encourage 85suited, if you have the time, to read the book as well and see what you think. It might scare you more! It actually did for me when talking about his Indonesian father, it was an awkward time in the book and Obama's relationship with him was pretty strange also, IMO. Some of the beliefs held by his Indonesian father are a bit "out there" for me.
Daniel, thanks for putting the quotes in context...I posted those as a strategy for McCain to use.... Like I said.... he couldnt... (I also didnt say it was excusable)

#29 wakiki

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 09:32 PM

View Postcopernicus, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 11:29 PM, said:

Why were you disgusted, when, based on their reaction, the people at that speech thought it was an attack on Palin.
Because Obama obviously didn't intend it to be, and because the McCain campaign was taking his quote out of context to pretend like it was. The crowds reaction was unpleasant, but it had nothing to do with what Obama really said.
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#30 strategy

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 09:48 PM

View Postwakiki, on Sunday, October 5th, 2008, 12:32 AM, said:

Because Obama obviously didn't intend it to be, and because the McCain campaign was taking his quote out of context to pretend like it was. The crowds reaction was unpleasant, but it had nothing to do with what Obama really said.
c'mon. it was peculiar wording... obama's camp had to have noticed it beforehand. you're giving him WAY too little credit here...
QUOTE (ShakeZuma @ Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011, 4:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
seriously though, with that grammar it's really like, I mean it doesn't bother me as much that she gets beat, you know?


#31 CaneBrain

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 09:51 PM

View Poststrategy, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 10:48 PM, said:

c'mon. it was peculiar wording... obama's camp had to have noticed it beforehand. you're giving him WAY too little credit here...
I agree he was referencing her lipstick line in a humorous way FOR SURE. But that is much different than being sexist or calling her a pig which he CLEARLY did not do.
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#32 85suited

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 09:55 PM

View PostCaneBrain, on Sunday, October 5th, 2008, 12:51 AM, said:

I agree he was referencing her lipstick line in a humorous way FOR SURE. But that is much different than being sexist or calling her a pig which he CLEARLY did not do.
I agree- but the crowd sure thought he was going there

#33 strategy

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 10:01 PM

View Post85suited, on Sunday, October 5th, 2008, 12:55 AM, said:

I agree- but the crowd sure thought he was going there
it reminds me of the "if you don't go to school you'll end up stuck in Iraq" comment from kerry. anyway, it really doesn't bother me regardless of obama's intent.
QUOTE (ShakeZuma @ Wednesday, November 2nd, 2011, 4:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
seriously though, with that grammar it's really like, I mean it doesn't bother me as much that she gets beat, you know?


#34 nutzbuster

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Posted 04 October 2008 - 11:20 PM

View PostDanielNegreanu, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 2:41 PM, said:

The Obama campaign is continuously trying to link the McCain camp to Bush and the last 8 years and is a central focus of their message. With Obama ahead in the polls it's unlikely that they will change that central message. The McCain camp has been changing their message in an attempt to distance themselves from the Bush years by changing their party line to "Change is Coming" while at the same time calling themselves the Maverick ticket that will get things done in Washington.1. Do you feel that could alienate Bush supporters?2. Do you think the Obama camps efforts to pin McCain to Bush has been effective in the eyes of the voters?3. If you were in the Obama camp, would your political strategy be similar in trying to make McCain and Bush seem linked at the hip?4. If you were working in the McCain camp, how would you try and deflect those claims while at the same time being respectful to those voters who approve of the current administration.My answers:1. I think the McCain camp is doing a good job of avoiding direct attacks on Bush and instead focusing their energy on changing congress. I don't think McCain has done much at all to alienate the Bush base. 2. I do think it is working. Especially to those voters that don't pay close attention, and realize that, no, Mcain and Bush are very different on a lot of issues, I think many are being convinced that Bush is McCain and McCain is Bush.3. Absolutely, and I think you'd be lying if you said you wouldn't take that approach, it's really a no-brainer especially with the country's economic woes as well as the extremely low approval rating of the current president. I think anytime a party president has a low approval rating this is a must-do tactic. In fact, I would try to do more of it.4. This is where I think Palin did a solid job. Whenever Biden brought up the last eight years she essentially mocked him effectively by saying, "Come on Joe, there you go again bringing up the past. John McCain and I are Mavericks and are looking to the future where we are going to shake up Washington and get things done. McCain has a long history of making things happen and that's what we are going to do." I thought that line of counter attack was brilliant. It's an obvious tactic being used by Obama/Biden to try and link Bush to McCain, and I think it's a smart move to make it obvious to voters that they are just putting a political spin on a situation that isn't entirely accurate. In fact, I'm already pretty sick of the line, "We can't have four more years of the same eight years we just had." I would sharpen that message and get way more specific. It's a weak line when overused and the Obama camp does have a lot of artillery they could use to glue the two together that's more powerful and effective. The war and the economy being the two key issues. I do enjoy politics. I am very clear on the fact that I am Obama supporter, but I can definitely appreciate good politics and find it entertaining. It's a game, and I like games. At this point I feel like it's getting into the third period and Obama is up two goals. If I were in the McCain camp I'd try to get even more aggressive. I'd also, seriously, change the subject. Attacking Obama HAS worked. Rev Wright- big issue. Tony Rezko, bring it up again. It would be totally transparent to do that, but I think McCain needs a game changer because the Obama camp is happy to play a careful game at this point and protect the lead.
I had a ton of crap lined up in rebuttal but I honestly cannot dispute most of this opinion. I do think the election will be close than most people think, simply because I think people will often say one thing and then at the last minute do the opposite.Remember back a bit.......all the polls had Kerry winning by a wide margin, and then....It's gonna be a nail biter



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#35 Balloon guy

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Posted 05 October 2008 - 12:16 AM

McCain needs to attack, for sure.He doesn't have the personality that will cause people to vote for him.He can only hope to make people vote against Obama.Time to slam home Obama's plans to raise taxes and create a healthcare plan that will cost trillions.Use the bad economy to slam that Obama will break the economy, either Obama will have to change his positions..ie flip flop. Or he will have to defend how raising taxes on the same corporations he just gasve $700 billion too is not whackolodial.Plus Palin needs to attack Obama on all the things McCain tried to pretend he was 'above' McCain has lackluster Republican support, he better energize his party.Obama needs to stress the immigration thing, that's what made Republicans not like McCain. Remind us why McCain is a bad republican.
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#36 Pot Odds RAC

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Posted 05 October 2008 - 03:47 AM

Linking McCain to Bush 43 is certainly "Negative" Politics, but well within "Standard". This is no more out of bounds than McCain using Ayers. Those of us who are still Bush supporters (yeah- we still exist) find it laughable when the Liberals link the two. McCain has been a thorn in the side of Bush and the Republican Party for a Decade. Many of us have claimed that we either wouldn't support McCain or at least would vote for him as a reluctant last choice. So it has been pretty masterful the way the Liberals (with the assistance of the Media) have linked McCain to Bush. I personally don't think it is "dirty" just Revisionist.In my opinion when Bush 41 lost to Clinton it was because he didn't fight "dirty" enough. McCain is flirting with the same fate and needs to be more ruthless (Ayers is a start) if he has any hope of winning this thing.

#37 Loismustdie

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Posted 05 October 2008 - 04:59 AM

When did Potomophobia turn into an insufferable grouchy so and so?
So much for a comeback.

#38 Pot Odds RAC

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Posted 05 October 2008 - 05:02 AM

View PostLoismustdie, on Sunday, October 5th, 2008, 8:59 AM, said:

When did Potomophobia turn into an insufferable grouchy so and so?
I was thinking the same thing! Someone pissed in his Wheaties.

#39 Loismustdie

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Posted 05 October 2008 - 05:25 AM

View PostDanielNegreanu, on Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 2:41 PM, said:

The Obama campaign is continuously trying to link the McCain camp to Bush and the last 8 years and is a central focus of their message. With Obama ahead in the polls it's unlikely that they will change that central message. The McCain camp has been changing their message in an attempt to distance themselves from the Bush years by changing their party line to "Change is Coming" while at the same time calling themselves the Maverick ticket that will get things done in Washington.1. Do you feel that could alienate Bush supporters?2. Do you think the Obama camps efforts to pin McCain to Bush has been effective in the eyes of the voters?3. If you were in the Obama camp, would your political strategy be similar in trying to make McCain and Bush seem linked at the hip?4. If you were working in the McCain camp, how would you try and deflect those claims while at the same time being respectful to those voters who approve of the current administration.My answers:1. I think the McCain camp is doing a good job of avoiding direct attacks on Bush and instead focusing their energy on changing congress. I don't think McCain has done much at all to alienate the Bush base. 2. I do think it is working. Especially to those voters that don't pay close attention, and realize that, no, Mcain and Bush are very different on a lot of issues, I think many are being convinced that Bush is McCain and McCain is Bush.3. Absolutely, and I think you'd be lying if you said you wouldn't take that approach, it's really a no-brainer especially with the country's economic woes as well as the extremely low approval rating of the current president. I think anytime a party president has a low approval rating this is a must-do tactic. In fact, I would try to do more of it.4. This is where I think Palin did a solid job. Whenever Biden brought up the last eight years she essentially mocked him effectively by saying, "Come on Joe, there you go again bringing up the past. John McCain and I are Mavericks and are looking to the future where we are going to shake up Washington and get things done. McCain has a long history of making things happen and that's what we are going to do." I thought that line of counter attack was brilliant. It's an obvious tactic being used by Obama/Biden to try and link Bush to McCain, and I think it's a smart move to make it obvious to voters that they are just putting a political spin on a situation that isn't entirely accurate. In fact, I'm already pretty sick of the line, "We can't have four more years of the same eight years we just had." I would sharpen that message and get way more specific. It's a weak line when overused and the Obama camp does have a lot of artillery they could use to glue the two together that's more powerful and effective. The war and the economy being the two key issues. I do enjoy politics. I am very clear on the fact that I am Obama supporter, but I can definitely appreciate good politics and find it entertaining. It's a game, and I like games. At this point I feel like it's getting into the third period and Obama is up two goals. If I were in the McCain camp I'd try to get even more aggressive. I'd also, seriously, change the subject. Attacking Obama HAS worked. Rev Wright- big issue. Tony Rezko, bring it up again. It would be totally transparent to do that, but I think McCain needs a game changer because the Obama camp is happy to play a careful game at this point and protect the lead.
I like most of this. I appreciate the effort that you have put out recently, more thought out posts, less rhetoric. Really well done. We can go at it again Wednesday after the debate, but until then, really, I see a difference in your approach. I will adjust mine accordingly. I ain't changing my sig, though. I like it.
So much for a comeback.

#40 Balloon guy

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Posted 05 October 2008 - 01:15 PM

View PostPot Odds RAC, on Sunday, October 5th, 2008, 4:47 AM, said:

Linking McCain to Bush 43 is certainly "Negative" Politics, but well within "Standard". This is no more out of bounds than McCain using Ayers. Those of us who are still Bush supporters (yeah- we still exist) find it laughable when the Liberals link the two. McCain has been a thorn in the side of Bush and the Republican Party for a Decade. Many of us have claimed that we either wouldn't support McCain or at least would vote for him as a reluctant last choice. So it has been pretty masterful the way the Liberals (with the assistance of the Media) have linked McCain to Bush. I personally don't think it is "dirty" just Revisionist.In my opinion when Bush 41 lost to Clinton it was because he didn't fight "dirty" enough. McCain is flirting with the same fate and needs to be more ruthless (Ayers is a start) if he has any hope of winning this thing.
That makes two us that still support Bush overall, but the spending and the lack of attention to the mortgage mess is a big negative for me.The linking Bush to McCain is false, like you said, but very good politically for Obama. The willing contributers in the press have really done a good job of making this stick, and in my opinion will be the reason he wins if he wins.
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