Jump to content


Heads Up Thread


  • Please log in to reply
89 replies to this topic

#21 BellaireDrew

BellaireDrew

    starting over

  • Members
  • 2,430 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Corinth, Texas

Posted 31 May 2008 - 09:16 AM

what kind of range do you all have with calling 3 bets? and what is your 4 bet range?
QUOTE (cwik @ Sunday, November 16th, 2008, 1:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Try balancing your range by beating her when you had a good day too.


#22 No_Neck

No_Neck

    this is how i roll

  • Members
  • 11,522 posts
  • Location:New Jersey OBV

Posted 31 May 2008 - 10:09 AM

View PostBellaireDrew, on Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 1:16 PM, said:

what kind of range do you all have with calling 3 bets? and what is your 4 bet range?
you are going to need to be WAYYYYYY more specific if you want an answer besides "it depends"

#23 cwik

cwik

    Bully for you.

  • Members
  • 3,606 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Monterey, CA

Posted 31 May 2008 - 01:06 PM

View PostBellaireDrew, on Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 10:16 AM, said:

what kind of range do you all have with calling 3 bets? and what is your 4 bet range?
it depends

#24 Acid_Knight

Acid_Knight

    I'm what's left. I'm what's right.

  • Members
  • 9,292 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Favorite Poker Game:You vs Me. Cagematch.

Posted 01 June 2008 - 09:23 AM

View Postcwik, on Saturday, May 31st, 2008, 2:06 PM, said:

it depends
He's lying.

#25 Naismith

Naismith

    Perry Friedman: I was planning on reloaded through Naismith

  • Members
  • 4,556 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:BWTBH
  • Favorite Poker Game:No Limit Crazy Pineapple

Posted 01 June 2008 - 09:29 AM

I call 3-bets pretty lightly, but most of my opponents insta-min-3bet (IT'S ALWAYS QJ!!!). It's really difficult to say because you just kind of get a feeling about your opponent's 3-betting and that dictates what you do. Some guys never 3-bet and get a lot of credit, some guys are just obviously FOS all the time.As far as 4-betting, I play so shallow that I 4-bet shove most pairs, AJ+ and sometimes KQ depending on the opponent. I have almost no fold equity when my opponents 3-bet, though, so I don't do it as bluffs. When I play deep, instead of 4-bet bluffing, I prefer to call, call flop and shove turn. That gets the most value out of my bluffs. :club:
Peace,
Jay



#26 Sheiky

Sheiky

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 4,734 posts
  • Location:Liverpool, England
  • Interests:Poker, sports, music
  • Favorite Poker Game:None, everyone hates poker

Posted 01 June 2008 - 10:20 AM

View PostAcid_Knight, on Sunday, June 1st, 2008, 6:23 PM, said:

He's lying.
That depends

#27 Temporary Nuts

Temporary Nuts

    Glub Glub

  • Members
  • 2,423 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:La La Land
  • Interests:Beer
  • Favorite Poker Game:Go Fish

Posted 02 June 2008 - 07:07 AM

Seriously though, assuming full stacks, is it a leak to open raise ATC from the button every time, or does that depend on how passive your opponent is?
QUOTE (NoBBiR @ Monday, August 11th, 2008, 7:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If god didn't want that particular law broken, he had no business making those that big.

Climb
Support your underground artists damnit

#28 No_Neck

No_Neck

    this is how i roll

  • Members
  • 11,522 posts
  • Location:New Jersey OBV

Posted 02 June 2008 - 07:13 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 11:07 AM, said:

it depends
ya i would say if he was aggro or passive you can do ti with lots of cards, just avoid hands like 93o or hands that will make the second best hand a lot. like K4o(IMHO)

#29 Sheiky

Sheiky

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 4,734 posts
  • Location:Liverpool, England
  • Interests:Poker, sports, music
  • Favorite Poker Game:None, everyone hates poker

Posted 02 June 2008 - 08:49 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 4:07 PM, said:

Seriously though, assuming full stacks, is it a leak to open raise ATC from the button every time, or does that depend on how passive your opponent is?
There's like a 300 post thread on 2+2 about this exact question, some people say it's profitable to raise 100% and do, some people say it isn't and don't, it really doesn't matter at all in the scheme of things.On Pokerroad Haralbos mentioned that he watched Andy Bloch play the $25k HU on Full Tilt and he said that he basicaly never ever folded his BB, Bloch seems to have pretty decent results in HU tourneys so I think it'd be really interesting to hear his reasoning behind that, especialy as he's very maths orientated.

#30 Acid_Knight

Acid_Knight

    I'm what's left. I'm what's right.

  • Members
  • 9,292 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Favorite Poker Game:You vs Me. Cagematch.

Posted 02 June 2008 - 08:58 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 8:07 AM, said:

Seriously though, assuming full stacks, is it a leak to open raise ATC from the button every time, or does that depend on how passive your opponent is?
It's variable on how good you are and how good/passive/aggressive they are. The short answer is that no, it's not going to be profitable to open every button at lower stakes, imo.

#31 No_Neck

No_Neck

    this is how i roll

  • Members
  • 11,522 posts
  • Location:New Jersey OBV

Posted 02 June 2008 - 09:04 AM

View PostAcid_Knight, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 12:58 PM, said:

It's variable on how good you are and how good/passive/aggressive they are. The short answer is that no, it's not going to be profitable to open every button because at lower stakes, imo.
[ ] last line makes sense(god I am bored)

#32 Naismith

Naismith

    Perry Friedman: I was planning on reloaded through Naismith

  • Members
  • 4,556 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:BWTBH
  • Favorite Poker Game:No Limit Crazy Pineapple

Posted 02 June 2008 - 09:07 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 7:07 AM, said:

Seriously though, assuming full stacks, is it a leak to open raise ATC from the button every time, or does that depend on how passive your opponent is?
Your opponents will dictate how often you raise the button. If your opponent is fighting for as many pots as he can get, you're going to want to tighten your raising range. If your opponent just calls preflop and check-folds the flop, raise 200 percent of your hands from the button. If your opponent is constantly check-raising you on flops or 3-betting you, tighten up the range a bit.When I'm deep, I play every button. Oh, also, Jordan taught me a little trick about minraising against annoying uber-call stations which is fun. Essentially, you're raising small and c-betting small, so it costs less to pick up those pots, but then when you actually have something (and no one ever has something heads up), you just continue jamming it after they've declared their flop intention to never, ever, ever fold no matter what. This works really well deep, in my experience, and is really annoying to play against, I think.
Peace,
Jay



#33 Acid_Knight

Acid_Knight

    I'm what's left. I'm what's right.

  • Members
  • 9,292 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Favorite Poker Game:You vs Me. Cagematch.

Posted 02 June 2008 - 09:20 AM

View PostNo_Neck, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 10:04 AM, said:

[ ] last line makes sense(god I am bored)
Edited. I had more typed in there and I cut it out because I didn't want to make people's heads explode with my awesome strat advice today am kind of lazy.

#34 Sheiky

Sheiky

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 4,734 posts
  • Location:Liverpool, England
  • Interests:Poker, sports, music
  • Favorite Poker Game:None, everyone hates poker

Posted 02 June 2008 - 10:54 AM

Full Tilt Poker Game #6665474217: $2 + $0.15 Heads Up Sit & Go (50662634), Table 1 - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:51:30 ET - 2008/06/02Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (1,470)Seat 2: spichot (1,530)RichardMcBeef90 posts the small blind of 15spichot posts the big blind of 30The button is in seat #1*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to RichardMcBeef90 [Js Ts]RichardMcBeef90 raises to 90spichot calls 60*** FLOP *** [Kd 8h 7h]spichot bets 30RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 30*** TURN *** [Kd 8h 7h] [3s]spichot bets 120RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 120*** RIVER *** [Kd 8h 7h 3s] [8d]spichot bets 270RichardMcBeef90 raises to 1,230, and is all inspichot foldsUncalled bet of 960 returned to RichardMcBeef90RichardMcBeef90 mucksRichardMcBeef90 wins the pot (1,020)*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 1,020 | Rake 0Board: [Kd 8h 7h 3s 8d]Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (small blind) collected (1,020), muckedSeat 2: spichot (big blind) folded on the River

#35 NoBBiR

NoBBiR

    F34l2 Durrrr

  • Members
  • 3,522 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Binghamton NY
  • Interests:Poker.
  • Favorite Poker Game:No Lemon Tennis Hold Me Tightly.

Posted 02 June 2008 - 11:22 AM

View Posttskillz187, on Friday, May 30th, 2008, 9:28 AM, said:

More info from all HU winners please.
More Manu.

View PostSheiky, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 10:54 AM, said:

Full Tilt Poker Game #6665474217: $2 + $0.15 Heads Up Sit & Go (50662634), Table 1 - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:51:30 ET - 2008/06/02Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (1,470)Seat 2: spichot (1,530)RichardMcBeef90 posts the small blind of 15spichot posts the big blind of 30The button is in seat #1*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to RichardMcBeef90 [Js Ts]RichardMcBeef90 raises to 90spichot calls 60*** FLOP *** [Kd 8h 7h]spichot bets 30RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 30*** TURN *** [Kd 8h 7h] [3s]spichot bets 120RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 120*** RIVER *** [Kd 8h 7h 3s] [8d]spichot bets 270RichardMcBeef90 raises to 1,230, and is all inspichot foldsUncalled bet of 960 returned to RichardMcBeef90RichardMcBeef90 mucksRichardMcBeef90 wins the pot (1,020)*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 1,020 | Rake 0Board: [Kd 8h 7h 3s 8d]Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (small blind) collected (1,020), muckedSeat 2: spichot (big blind) folded on the River
Raise his flop bet, obv.
"How do they put the ****ing queen in the window?"

Darvin Moon, I hope you die in a grease fire.

#36 ROBBBIGG

ROBBBIGG

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 1,176 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:internet
  • Favorite Poker Game:limping queens

Posted 02 June 2008 - 11:40 AM

View PostSheiky, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 10:54 AM, said:

Full Tilt Poker Game #6665474217: $2 + $0.15 Heads Up Sit & Go (50662634), Table 1 - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:51:30 ET - 2008/06/02Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (1,470)Seat 2: spichot (1,530)RichardMcBeef90 posts the small blind of 15spichot posts the big blind of 30The button is in seat #1*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to RichardMcBeef90 [Js Ts]RichardMcBeef90 raises to 90spichot calls 60*** FLOP *** [Kd 8h 7h]spichot bets 30RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 30*** TURN *** [Kd 8h 7h] [3s]spichot bets 120RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 120*** RIVER *** [Kd 8h 7h 3s] [8d]spichot bets 270RichardMcBeef90 raises to 1,230, and is all inspichot foldsUncalled bet of 960 returned to RichardMcBeef90RichardMcBeef90 mucksRichardMcBeef90 wins the pot (1,020)*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 1,020 | Rake 0Board: [Kd 8h 7h 3s 8d]Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (small blind) collected (1,020), muckedSeat 2: spichot (big blind) folded on the River
why did you do that stuff
alexeimartov: lets both hope there isn't an fpp vip option
alexeimartov: to kill your whole family

#37 Sheiky

Sheiky

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 4,734 posts
  • Location:Liverpool, England
  • Interests:Poker, sports, music
  • Favorite Poker Game:None, everyone hates poker

Posted 02 June 2008 - 11:56 AM

View PostNoBBiR, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 8:22 PM, said:

More Manu.Raise his flop bet, obv.
First hand so I head not much idea what his leading range was, i didn't want to get called by a pair of 8s of whatever when calling the flop/betting on late streets looks stronger imo, + it was a $2 tourney so i was experiementing with new lines

View PostROBBBIGG, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 8:40 PM, said:

why did you do that stuff
Flop bet - Normaly weak, could be strong/medium strength handTurn - I think that was a pretty weak bet actual;y, and from floating in other situations i always seem to get double barreled because it's obvious i can call the flop min bet with basically anything so I called because i can still do something on the riverRiver - Super weak bet, i think he's rarely calling a shove here, so i shove

#38 ROBBBIGG

ROBBBIGG

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 1,176 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:internet
  • Favorite Poker Game:limping queens

Posted 02 June 2008 - 12:25 PM

View PostSheiky, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 11:56 AM, said:

First hand so I head not much idea what his leading range was, i didn't want to get called by a pair of 8s of whatever when calling the flop/betting on late streets looks stronger imo, + it was a $2 tourney so i was experiementing with new linesFlop bet - Normaly weak, could be strong/medium strength handTurn - I think that was a pretty weak bet actual;y, and from floating in other situations i always seem to get double barreled because it's obvious i can call the flop min bet with basically anything so I called because i can still do something on the riverRiver - Super weak bet, i think he's rarely calling a shove here, so i shove
usually first hand isn't the best time to try anything sick, esp in 2 dollar hu sngs, where you get called with a lot of hands. i've probably pulled something similar, shoving when i think villain can't call unless he's got a monster, but a. you prob want some reads and b. calling down and then shoving looks pretty odd. i prob would raise the flop with my gutter or call and raise the turn, and give up if called without hitting. i guess you're repping trips or a flush, but usually hu players raise with their flush draws, so you're sorta repping a pretty small range (called down with mp and spiked trips). you're also not getting a ton of value with your bluff. it'll probably be a lot cheaper to raise the flop or call and raise the turn than it is to shove all in on a value bet or three barrel.
alexeimartov: lets both hope there isn't an fpp vip option
alexeimartov: to kill your whole family

#39 cwik

cwik

    Bully for you.

  • Members
  • 3,606 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Monterey, CA

Posted 02 June 2008 - 12:32 PM

View PostSheiky, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 12:56 PM, said:

First hand so I head not much idea what his leading range was, i didn't want to get called by a pair of 8s of whatever when calling the flop/betting on late streets looks stronger imo, + it was a $2 tourney so i was experiementing with new linesFlop bet - Normaly weak, could be strong/medium strength handTurn - I think that was a pretty weak bet actual;y, and from floating in other situations i always seem to get double barreled because it's obvious i can call the flop min bet with basically anything so I called because i can still do something on the riverRiver - Super weak bet, i think he's rarely calling a shove here, so i shove
LOL, that hand is a HUGE spew.raise flop. If not fold turn. If not, I don't hate river line except it is the first hand of a $2 sng... which I am certian makes it a -EV play.

#40 Acid_Knight

Acid_Knight

    I'm what's left. I'm what's right.

  • Members
  • 9,292 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Favorite Poker Game:You vs Me. Cagematch.

Posted 02 June 2008 - 12:36 PM

View PostSheiky, on Monday, June 2nd, 2008, 11:54 AM, said:

Full Tilt Poker Game #6665474217: $2 + $0.15 Heads Up Sit & Go (50662634), Table 1 - 15/30 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:51:30 ET - 2008/06/02Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (1,470)Seat 2: spichot (1,530)RichardMcBeef90 posts the small blind of 15spichot posts the big blind of 30The button is in seat #1*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to RichardMcBeef90 [Js Ts]RichardMcBeef90 raises to 90spichot calls 60*** FLOP *** [Kd 8h 7h]spichot bets 30RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 30*** TURN *** [Kd 8h 7h] [3s]spichot bets 120RichardMcBeef90 has 15 seconds left to actRichardMcBeef90 calls 120*** RIVER *** [Kd 8h 7h 3s] [8d]spichot bets 270RichardMcBeef90 raises to 1,230, and is all inspichot foldsUncalled bet of 960 returned to RichardMcBeef90RichardMcBeef90 mucksRichardMcBeef90 wins the pot (1,020)*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 1,020 | Rake 0Board: [Kd 8h 7h 3s 8d]Seat 1: RichardMcBeef90 (small blind) collected (1,020), muckedSeat 2: spichot (big blind) folded on the River
Raise the flop most of the time in position. I don't really love the naked float on the two tone board unless you have a better handle on what he donks with. On the turn, raise or fold. Calling is bad for so many reasons inlcuding the fact that it's slightly more likely he has a real hand since he's betting twice, you have no hand, and you look weak so he's likely to bluff the river with his entire range meaning that you have to put your stack at risk to make a bluff.When you get to the river, you're shoving and you're repping basically nothing since there's like no way you don't raise the flop/turn with KK and you prob raise the flop with 8x. Getting fancy is fine, but have a reason to do it. Randomly double floating donks in $2 sngs is probably never gonna be profitable. The whole idea of this hand is spewriffic.Edit: I just noticed the flop is monotone. For god's sake fold the flop or raise him. It's like raising>folding>calling AINEC. The turn is about the same ranking. Calling is like the worst option by far on each street.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users