Monday Night Club Hand

[finztotheleft 0]

I'll convert later, just need a place to dump these for nowPokerStars Game #16566753246: Hold'em Limit (10/20) - 2008/04/07 - 21:31:49 (ET)Table 'Philia' 9-max (Play Money) Seat #1 is the buttonSeat 1: vervius (415 in chips) Seat 4: finztothelft (585 in chips) Seat 6: bobbywithani (240 in chips) Seat 7: ROBBBIGG (1600 in chips) Seat 8: vbnautilus (4340 in chips) Seat 9: aurman (368 in chips) Beaverstyle will be allowed to play after the buttonfinztothelft: posts small blind 5bobbywithani: posts big blind 10*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to finztothelft [7s Ad]ROBBBIGG said, "nvm"ROBBBIGG said, "search away"vervius said, "just make yourself available... otherwise i think its in the menus"ROBBBIGG: calls 10drcossack said, "lol"vbnautilus: folds aurman: raises 10 to 20vervius: folds finztothelft: calls 15bobbywithani: folds ROBBBIGG: calls 10*** FLOP *** [3c Td 7c]finztothelft: bets 10ROBBBIGG said, "if you have pennies sit at my tables and crush me"ROBBBIGG: raises 10 to 20aurman: calls 20finztothelft said, "under options"finztothelft: calls 10*** TURN *** [3c Td 7c] [3h]finztothelft: checks ROBBBIGG: bets 20aurman: raises 20 to 40ROBBBIGG said, "let's cap this"finztothelft: folds ROBBBIGG: calls 20*** RIVER *** [3c Td 7c 3h] [As]ROBBBIGG: checks aurman: bets 20ROBBBIGG: calls 20*** SHOW DOWN ***aurman: shows [Ac Kh] (two pair, Aces and Threes)ROBBBIGG: mucks hand ROBBBIGG said, "LOL"aurman collected 250 from potROBBBIGG said, "k10clubs"*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 250 | Rake 0 Board [3c Td 7c 3h As]Seat 1: vervius (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 4: finztothelft (small blind) folded on the TurnSeat 6: bobbywithani (big blind) folded before FlopSeat 7: ROBBBIGG mucked [Kc Tc]Seat 8: vbnautilus folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: aurman showed [Ac Kh] and won (250) with two pair, Aces and Threes

[Zach6668 513]

That's a really really ugly hand.

[Roo6339 0]

Fold pre-flop. Check/raise or check/fold flop I think. Could be way off though...Wait... just realized this is short handed... Ignore my advice cause I never play short.

[Zach6668 513]

I'd say there's 3 people who made mistakes in this hand. One person screwed it up waaaaay bad, the other screwed it up kinda medium, and the other just made a small mistake.Try and guess who is who?

[checkymcfold 0]

I'd say there's 3 people who made mistakes in this hand. One person screwed it up waaaaay bad, the other screwed it up kinda medium, and the other just made a small mistake.

i agree.

[ROBBBIGG 0]

was i the one who screwed it up waaaaay bad

[Zach6668 513]

toss up between you and the AK

[finztotheleft 0]

I'd say there's 3 people who made mistakes in this hand. One person screwed it up waaaaay bad, the other screwed it up kinda medium, and the other just made a small mistake.Try and guess who is who?

I think I'm the major screw up. I have no idea what I was thinking calling preflop there. And this was obviously was before the donk betting lesson from last week. I forget now what my specific question was on this hand. ROBBBIGG shouldn't be pushing the flush draw with only 3 of us there. Should aurman 3 bet the flop ?

[Zach6668 513]

Na, finz, yours was the minor mistake. We agree preflop sucks though, and that's good. I despise your donkbet on the flop, as I hate donk bets in general. We get to check here, and see it go bet/raise in front of us, and we can fold the worst hand without worrying about it, OR investing a bet (or two). I actually missed that part when I first looked at the hand, so I'm upgrading you to a semi-bad play, lol.When I first looked at it, I thought robbbigg's was worst, but looking again, I think he and AK both kinda played it quite poorly.I'll explain. Robbbigg's first mistake was the preflop limp. Clearly that's awful. The flop was good, the turn is debatable though, as a 3-bet could have some value. I doubt it though. Aurmen has to have a super strong range when he coldcalls the flop and raises the turn. So, I'm changing my assessment again, but, aside from PF, I don't think Robbbigg played it that poorly.AK on the other hand, played it far worse than I originally thought. Apparently I suck at reading HHs that weren't converted. .Anywho, PF is obviously fine for him. But the flop is pretty bad. Getting 4.5-1, not closing the action, AK needs to hit the muck here.The turn is pretty weird. I can understand the idea that we're raising for a free showdown/semi bluff type thing, but in this pot, with this much strength shown, I think it's a major spew. River, once we get there, is obviously fine.So, there's my analysis. I hate when I just post that people played poorly without explanation, but sometimes I like to get you guys thinking on your own, and hopefully come back here and post what you think you did wrong (like you did, Finz), or ask some questions.

[finztotheleft 0]

Ugh. So I've got my own donktasticness down, but I'm evaluating ROBB and auroman wrong. Sigh. Hence why I am still a work in progress.

[Zach6668 513]

ROBBBIGG shouldn't be pushing the flush draw with only 3 of us there. Should aurman 3 bet the flop ?

Well, ROBBBIGG has top pair plus the 2nd nut flush draw. So he's right to ram and jam here. Even if it was 3-handed, he'd still usually be in a good spot to jam. The flush draw would basically be breakeven for him (slight positive return, maybe negated by not having the nut flush draw), but any overcard outs easily push it to show a positive return. I'm not necessarily talking about this flop, as a paired board would screw things up a bit. In general tho, if we have a flush draw in a 3-way pot, especially if we have an overcard or two, or we think we have live cards, etc, we should be going to town. Especially if we think we can pick up some added fold equity somewhere. Every little bit counts.On this flop, there's no way AK is good enough to peel here, getting 4.5-1 in a 3-way pot, not closing the action, with 6 outs, which are never ever ever entirely clean, and so on. AK needs to fold the flop.