Jump to content


Getting Cute With Aces


  • Please log in to reply
85 replies to this topic

#41 Canute

Canute

    Poker Forum Newbie

  • Members
  • 66 posts
  • Favorite Poker Game:NL Holdem

Posted 18 March 2008 - 02:40 PM

View PostJadaki, on Tuesday, March 18th, 2008, 3:02 PM, said:

That was one example of a villain playing a hand that hit the flop really hard with draws on the board just from this session, past experience with the villain says it's fairly consistent in a raised or a limped pot. He could be changing it up, but it's unlikely. If he is scared of a draw, he overbets. A smaller bet had me thinking either 2 pair, pair and a draw, combo draw (straight & Flush) or maybe even just trying to buy it though I think that is a small % of the time given his history.Given that info, aces being under represented and stack sizes, hero calls (at this point regretting not raising preflop.... yea I know already).River: 8dPot is 143.00. A few straight draws get there, no flush though. Hero has villain covered and he is about 170 behind at this point.Lead out or check?*I wont be back to check on this till tomorrow, have fun ripping it apart.
I think you check. You are in a real pickle here. You limped a big pair out of position. You have shown some weakness by just calling the turn. If he has one pair or a busted draw, he is likely to check behind which you will welcome. He may try to bluff bet, but I don't think it is too likely given that you already called the turn raise. If he has two pair or better he will definitelly bet some where in the neighborhood of 100 or 150. If he bets this much, you have to lay it down. And if he was bluffing a busted draw.... He just outplayed you. Raise those things preflop next time!

#42 BaseJester

BaseJester

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 2,109 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Castle
  • Interests:Juggling. Ventriloquism. Story-telling.
  • Favorite Poker Game:The quintain

Posted 18 March 2008 - 02:52 PM

View PostJadaki, on Tuesday, March 18th, 2008, 6:02 PM, said:

Pot is 143.00. A few straight draws get there, no flush though. Hero has villain covered and he is about 170 behind at this point.Lead out or check?
Gee-whiz, wouldn't it be better if we were all-in on the turn? Gosh, what to do now?Check and call.
If everybody is thinking the same thing, then somebody isn't thinking.
- General George Patton

#43 dms26

dms26

    Poker Forum God

  • Members
  • 21,900 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 18 March 2008 - 06:40 PM

View PostJadaki, on Tuesday, March 18th, 2008, 6:02 PM, said:

Lead out or check?*I wont be back to check on this till tomorrow, have fun ripping it apart.
I think it's an easy check, let him bet missed draws that he can't call with. If you have the worst hand then lose the min.
QUOTE (CozMyn @ Sunday, March 8th, 2009, 5:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
i tried to talk here about that program, the RNG , not to talk about when to accept all in without to see flop.
You can accept all in whenever you want, or whenever you feel lucky, but in virtual room's is not like in reality. In reality anything is possible... in virtual rooms you can be "the one" who knows the future, or who can change the future.

#44 fckthis

fckthis

    mmmmmmm Alba

  • Members
  • 2,038 posts
  • Location:Canada
  • Interests:Long walks on gravel,<br />watching my 67year old neighbour undress,<br /><br />poker

Posted 18 March 2008 - 09:06 PM

ye sorry but preflop play nulls the hand basically. so so so bad.
Mike Matusow: want to play some o 8
Mike Matusow: 5001k
Ram Vaswani: you to good at 500 1k but i play you 1k 2k

#45 Jadaki

Jadaki

    IIOY?

  • Members
  • 22,247 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 19 March 2008 - 10:58 AM

View PostCanute, on Tuesday, March 18th, 2008, 5:40 PM, said:

If he has two pair or better he will definitelly bet some where in the neighborhood of 100 or 150. If he bets this much, you have to lay it down. And if he was bluffing a busted draw.... He just outplayed you.
Hero checks, villain bets 50.00.Seems small right? So... Raise, Fold or Call?

#46 Temporary Nuts

Temporary Nuts

    Glub Glub

  • Members
  • 2,423 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:La La Land
  • Interests:Beer
  • Favorite Poker Game:Go Fish

Posted 19 March 2008 - 11:01 AM

View PostJadaki, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 2:58 PM, said:

Hero checks, villain bets 50.00.Seems small right? So... Raise, Fold or Call?
Why are you dragging out this trainwreck?
QUOTE (NoBBiR @ Monday, August 11th, 2008, 7:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If god didn't want that particular law broken, he had no business making those that big.

Climb
Support your underground artists damnit

#47 Canute

Canute

    Poker Forum Newbie

  • Members
  • 66 posts
  • Favorite Poker Game:NL Holdem

Posted 19 March 2008 - 11:03 AM

View PostJadaki, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 10:58 AM, said:

Hero checks, villain bets 50.00.Seems small right? So... Raise, Fold or Call?
Call. It's a no brainer. Tiny river bet, a ton of money in the pot now and a good chance you have the best hand.

#48 BaseJester

BaseJester

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 2,109 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Castle
  • Interests:Juggling. Ventriloquism. Story-telling.
  • Favorite Poker Game:The quintain

Posted 19 March 2008 - 11:06 AM

View PostJadaki, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 2:58 PM, said:

Hero checks, villain bets 50.00.Seems small right? So... Raise, Fold or Call?
Call.
If everybody is thinking the same thing, then somebody isn't thinking.
- General George Patton

#49 Kwan Li

Kwan Li

    Poker Forum Newbie

  • Members
  • 89 posts
  • Favorite Poker Game:Hold 'Em

Posted 19 March 2008 - 11:13 AM

I don't mean to be a jackass or anything (not true) but limping AA is absolutely atrocious.Assuming this is a standard 1/2NL Live game, then on a bad day, the average player has maybe half a brain. Just for giggles, you should have bumped it up to 20 (if not more) pre-flop and most likely you would have gotten 2/3 callers. Then you can just proceed with the hand la dee doo with 10000x less problems than you have on this hand.Anyways.Flop bet is good.Turn bet is tiny. Bet should be at least 1/2 the pot if not more. After betting more than 1/2 the pot and assuming MP3 has raised, I would say, "Self, I played this hand horribly and I'm going to do myself a favor and fold it."If you find yourself unable to fold, then call/call should be the next most appropriate line.As played, river bet is an insta-call.

#50 Acid_Knight

Acid_Knight

    I'm what's left. I'm what's right.

  • Members
  • 9,292 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Favorite Poker Game:You vs Me. Cagematch.

Posted 19 March 2008 - 11:37 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 12:01 PM, said:

Why are you dragging out this trainwreck?
+ Eleventy Brazillion + 1

#51 Naismith

Naismith

    Perry Friedman: I was planning on reloaded through Naismith

  • Members
  • 4,556 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:BWTBH
  • Favorite Poker Game:No Limit Crazy Pineapple

Posted 19 March 2008 - 01:40 PM

I have a very simple rule about slowplayed hands in multi-way pots.If I play a hand like rags preflop, I fold it like rags post-flop. :club:
Peace,
Jay



#52 El Guapo

El Guapo

    Like A Boss!

  • Members
  • 16,439 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Carmen's Flower

Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:09 PM

Josh friggin post the results already, you aren't going to get anymore insight unless you just want people to guess random hands.

#53 mtdesmoines

mtdesmoines

    Poker Forum Veteran

  • Members
  • 9,980 posts

Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:17 PM

View PostNaismith, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 1:40 PM, said:

I have a very simple rule about slowplayed hands in multi-way pots.If I play a hand like rags preflop, I fold it like rags post-flop. :club:
QFMFTEDIT: Someone kill this thread. There's no strat in discussing AA limped v the rest of the table.
Somewhere Jimmy Carter is smiling because he knows that he is no longer the worst President of the modern era

#54 Temporary Nuts

Temporary Nuts

    Glub Glub

  • Members
  • 2,423 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:La La Land
  • Interests:Beer
  • Favorite Poker Game:Go Fish

Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:18 PM

View PostNaismith, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 5:40 PM, said:

I have a very simple rule about slowplayed hands in multi-way pots.If I play a hand like rags preflop, I shove it like rags post-flop. :club:
FYP
QUOTE (NoBBiR @ Monday, August 11th, 2008, 7:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If god didn't want that particular law broken, he had no business making those that big.

Climb
Support your underground artists damnit

#55 Acid_Knight

Acid_Knight

    I'm what's left. I'm what's right.

  • Members
  • 9,292 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Favorite Poker Game:You vs Me. Cagematch.

Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:24 PM

View PostEl Guapo, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 3:09 PM, said:

Josh friggin post the results already, you aren't going to get anymore insight unless you just want people to guess random hands.
Hi. Welcome to the Strat Forum. The land where results don't matter. :club:

#56 Temporary Nuts

Temporary Nuts

    Glub Glub

  • Members
  • 2,423 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:La La Land
  • Interests:Beer
  • Favorite Poker Game:Go Fish

Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:28 PM

View PostAcid_Knight, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 6:24 PM, said:

Hi. Welcome to the Strat Forum. The land where results don't matter. :club:
Yes they do. Because he can post how he check-raise shoved the river, got a fold, and we can mock him for finding a way to turn aces into a bluff.
QUOTE (NoBBiR @ Monday, August 11th, 2008, 7:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If god didn't want that particular law broken, he had no business making those that big.

Climb
Support your underground artists damnit

#57 psujohn

psujohn

    There is no charge for awesomeness

  • Members
  • 3,788 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:MD

Posted 19 March 2008 - 02:48 PM

View PostNaismith, on Wednesday, March 19th, 2008, 5:40 PM, said:

I have a very simple rule about slowplayed hands in multi-way pots.If I play a hand like rags preflop, I fold it like rags post-flop. :club:
QFT. Limping AA with 4 in means your playing for set value. I c/f every street.

#58 CobaltBlue

CobaltBlue

    The Outlier

  • Members
  • 10,364 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Royal Palm Beach, FL
  • Favorite Poker Game:Hold 'Em, Crazy Pineapple, 2-7 TD

Posted 20 March 2008 - 01:58 AM

Most of y'all have reached correct conclusions, and yet no one's keyed in on the levels (images and psychology) at play. Jadaki says that his tight image is relevant here, right? Despite the fact that we've underrepresented our hand and therefore villain could be raising lighter (single pairs and draws), this is unlikely if he shows any perception for our image. Additionally, if this bet-sizing is standard for the game, it's unlikely that a competent villain takes it immediately for weakness. Two bets OOP from a "tight" SB on this board is indicative of strength. He confronts that strength with a raise. Y'all have concluded that his range beats ours.

#59 Jadaki

Jadaki

    IIOY?

  • Members
  • 22,247 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 20 March 2008 - 08:34 AM

View PostCobaltBlue, on Thursday, March 20th, 2008, 4:58 AM, said:

Most of y'all have reached correct conclusions, and yet no one's keyed in on the levels (images and psychology) at play. Jadaki says that his tight image is relevant here, right? Despite the fact that we've underrepresented our hand and therefore villain could be raising lighter (single pairs and draws), this is unlikely if he shows any perception for our image. Additionally, if this bet-sizing is standard for the game, it's unlikely that a competent villain takes it immediately for weakness. Two bets OOP from a "tight" SB on this board is indicative of strength. He confronts that strength with a raise. Y'all have concluded that his range beats ours.
TY for the response. EG if you want results I'll send them to you in a PM later, I don't plan on posting them because Acid is right. I guess I don't get the point of a strat forum is if the only advise anyone ever has is never limp aces. If every person plays every hand the exact same way it kind of defeats the purpose, right? I posted the hand because I had put myself in a tough spot on the turn and wondered what other players would do._____Example of a hand that took place roughly 30 minutes before this one.Hero is AA, in SB with 168 in play.UTG folds, UTG +1 raises 10.00, MP1 Calls, Folds to Button who calls, SB raises to 50.00, BB folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Button Calls.4 players, pot = 202.00Flop AKKHero Bets 118, UTG+1 Folds, MP1 Calls, Button Folds._____Difference between this hand and the one posted is the preflop raise from EP, 2 callers and all 3 of these players being willing to put a lot of cash in preflop. In the hand originally posted only one of these players was still at the table and he folded preflop. The table had tightened up, no one was still calling huge raises preflop. A raise to twenty would have caused the table to fold around, even a raise to 10-16 (my standard raise in this game) from me would have gone uncalled... I asked this of the players who limped preflop after the hand was over, they all confirmed they were not playing their hands to a raise from me. Raising anything less than that wasn't going to filter out limping hands anyway so the hand plays nearly the same.

#60 dms26

dms26

    Poker Forum God

  • Members
  • 21,900 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 20 March 2008 - 08:57 AM

View PostJadaki, on Thursday, March 20th, 2008, 12:34 PM, said:

I guess I don't get the point of a strat forum is if the only advise anyone ever has is never limp aces. If every person plays every hand the exact same way it kind of defeats the purpose, right? I posted the hand because I had put myself in a tough spot on the turn and wondered what other players would do.
It's not that I've never limped with AA, but I'd bet a lot of money that I've never limped from the SB after 3? limpers. I raise in that spot 100% of the time, if everyone folds so be it. I prefer not to intentionally put myself in tough spots if I can avoid it.
QUOTE (CozMyn @ Sunday, March 8th, 2009, 5:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
i tried to talk here about that program, the RNG , not to talk about when to accept all in without to see flop.
You can accept all in whenever you want, or whenever you feel lucky, but in virtual room's is not like in reality. In reality anything is possible... in virtual rooms you can be "the one" who knows the future, or who can change the future.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users