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Soft Severed Deep Nuts With Action


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#1 cwik

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 01:45 AM

Villain is an loose-aggressive donk. He hasn't been sitting too long. I am SLAG.No Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $0.50/$16 playersConverterStack sizes:UTG: $98.50Hero: $288.05CO: $100.10Button: $193.34SB: $92.14BB: $105.30Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG+1 with Q :club: K :D UTG folds, Hero raises to $4, CO folds, Button raises to $8, 2 folds, Hero calls.Flop: T :D A :D J :D ($17.5, 2 players)Hero checks, Button bets $7, Hero raises to $23, Button raises to $46,Hero...OK what is my most EV line here?

#2 Dictius

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 02:03 AM

re-minraise obv.

#3 pokerinc

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 02:07 AM

severed nuts sounds -ev.
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#4 NoBBiR

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 04:32 AM

View Postcwik, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 1:45 AM, said:

Villain is an loose-aggressive donk. He hasn't been sitting too long. I am SLAG.No Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $0.50/$16 playersConverterStack sizes:UTG: $98.50Hero: $288.05CO: $100.10Button: $193.34SB: $92.14BB: $105.30Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG+1 with Q :club: K :D UTG folds, Hero raises to $4, CO folds, Button raises to $8, 2 folds, Hero calls.Flop: T :D A :D J :D ($17.5, 2 players)Hero checks, Button bets $7, Hero raises to $23, Button raises to $46,Hero...OK what is my most EV line here?
He's a lag donk?Call and check the turn and let him bluff shove, obv.
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#5 Acid_Knight

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 05:48 AM

What is his range do you think? If you think he ever has AT or AJ here, I just go ahead and reraise the flop and get it in. If you think he's ever got QJ/KJ type hands for a pair/gutter, I think you reraise the flop becuase he's gonna check back the turn a lot.I actually like the minreraise or repop him to like $99 tota.

#6 mtdesmoines

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 06:30 AM

View PostDictius, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 2:03 AM, said:

re-minraise obv.
it bloats the pot enough to shove the turn. which is what we want
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#7 Craigdog

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 07:00 AM

View Postmtdesmoines, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 6:30 AM, said:

it bloats the pot enough to shove the turn. which is what we want
Probably the best line for this hand imo.
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#8 Temporary Nuts

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 08:01 AM

Call, check, shove.If you take this line and a broadway card falls before you shove, get over it you're shoving anyway.
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#9 ROBBBIGG

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 09:24 AM

If villain isn't stupid, 6 handed, this is probably a call, lead out, shove any card. If villain is dumb or this is HU, shove.
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#10 Sheiky

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 09:30 AM

Re-raise imo.It's simple, but i think it gets his whole stack more often than other lines

#11 Merlopj

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 10:02 AM

what they said...So did he turn or river the boat with his JJ?

#12 TB17

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 11:22 AM

Seriously guys?How is this not a 4 bet? What hand is he 3 betting with that he can fold to a 4 bet? AK, Maybe JT, Maybe AT. Since he's a donk, I do NOT see him folding. I dont see how you can call and let paint fall or let the board pair. If he has QQ/KK and you call hes probably not gonna give any action unless more paint falls. I see little value to calling as it can only hurt you. If you were in position I can see a call here, but OOP I think you just have to get the money in ASAP.
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#13 Acid_Knight

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 11:39 AM

View PostTB17, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 11:22 AM, said:

If you were in position I can see a call here, but OOP I think you just have to get the money in ASAP.
I agree and bad players will stack off with AK/AQ here sometimes too figuring they have lots of outs even if you have made 2 pair already.

#14 Temporary Nuts

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 11:58 AM

View PostTB17, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 2:22 PM, said:

What hand is he 3 betting with that he can fold to a 4 bet?
"What hand is he raising with that he can fold to a three bet?""What hand is he betting with that he can fold to a raise?"This type of thinking is flawed... not necessarily the conclusion you came to, but this type of thinking is.
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#15 cwik

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 02:50 PM

Honestly after the minraise pf, I had him for incredibly strong, figured him for the set, but maybe AJ. If I am raising here, what do we like best, minbet, $110ish, shove?

#16 No_Neck

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 03:03 PM

View Postcwik, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 5:50 PM, said:

Honestly after the minraise pf, I had him for incredibly strong, figured him for the set, but maybe AJ. If I am raising here, what do we like best, minbet, $110ish, shove?
I raise just slightly above min raise make it look like there might be the slightest chance I will fold for the $50 more dollars. :)To be honest I probably fall into the trap of juts calling and watch the J roll off and kill my action.:club:

#17 Acid_Knight

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 03:03 PM

View Postcwik, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 2:50 PM, said:

Honestly after the minraise pf, I had him for incredibly strong, figured him for the set, but maybe AJ. If I am raising here, what do we like best, minbet, $110ish, shove?
I like the minbet or like $95. He's never not shoving AJ/AT or a set on you after you do that.doublenegatives FTW!

#18 TB17

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 03:35 PM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 12:58 PM, said:

"What hand is he raising with that he can fold to a three bet?""What hand is he betting with that he can fold to a raise?"This type of thinking is flawed... not necessarily the conclusion you came to, but this type of thinking is.
Explain.
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#19 Acid_Knight

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 03:49 PM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 11:58 AM, said:

"What hand is he raising with that he can fold to a three bet?""What hand is he betting with that he can fold to a raise?"This type of thinking is flawed... not necessarily the conclusion you came to, but this type of thinking is.
This is actually fundamental. In general, each raise increment that someone makes represents a deeper and deeper commitment to the pot and a (theoretically) stronger and stronger hand.When someone puts in a 3rd bet post flop, they usually have total air or a hand that they will not fold.Take it 1 step down and you'll see people raise with a wide variety of made hands, draws and air on the flop without having made up their mind what they're going to do if they are raised.

#20 TB17

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Posted 31 January 2008 - 04:00 PM

View PostAcid_Knight, on Thursday, January 31st, 2008, 4:49 PM, said:

This is actually fundamental. In general, each raise increment that someone makes represents a deeper and deeper commitment to the pot and a (theoretically) stronger and stronger hand.When someone puts in a 3rd bet post flop, they usually have total air or a hand that they will not fold.Take it 1 step down and you'll see people raise with a wide variety of made hands, draws and air on the flop without having made up their mind what they're going to do if they are raised.
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