8 replies to this topic

[Eskimo]

I recently read an article by Chris Ferguson about limping in. He said he never limps in, he either raises the blinds or folds!! Any opinions on this?

[360f1]

I think he actually said he never limps in under the gun. He'll limp from other positions.

[cmak3687]

not limping under the gun makes a little more sense, not limping at all is ridiculous. you have to limp in games with low blind structures.

[Suited_Up]

Just to add on... I am pretty sure Annie Duke's practice is to never limp if First in the pot... thought i'd throw that out there.... also add that some of these policies are good for the top game... but low limits and online and stuff like that... I just don't think they apply.

[Awful]

Raising coming in helps narrow the field, define hands, and build a pot. It's a basis for your subsequent reads, and it serves to maximize the number of times you win the pot. Yes, I know the goal is to win money, not pots, but increasing the proportion of pots won will help the ROI on the preflop bet, and the pot will be decently large when someone plays for your raise.It can also make overly loose opponents justified in chasing, or deny bluffing opportunities due to pot odds on subsequent streets, or cause you to make a courtesy bet into a family pot when you flopped nothing, and other unpleasantness.If it doesn't achieve the proper positive ends (i.e. really loose game, hands to river often, people don't know "how to play" certain hands properly), then it may be better to not raise, see the flop, and continue only when justified. Basically, it goes back not to what Chris Ferguson, or Annie Duke, or Daniel or anyone has to say, but know what the reasons you have for doing something are, see if they mesh well with the texture of the game you're currently playing and the opponents you are facing. When you read those people's work, do it to add things to your toolbox and work out how certain plays derive their value and so on. If you're playing a real passive, loose game (i.e. small online limits, like my broke student self), you can limp 1st in with "crap" like a suited K-trash IF you'll pick up a few people, not get raised, and also can be called down reliably by the table should you hit a decent draw or otherwise flop nicely (2 pair, trips made with your garbage card, etc.). At a tough table, you won't pick up enough hitchikers and are too likely to be raised and subsequently risk money on later streets with a hand that has many ways to be second-best. Again, develop the tools to analyze scenarios; for example, against people who play position well, it is imperative you open with a raise, because the blinds are the only potential callers who would act before you on subsequent betting rounds. By eliminating people behind you with marginal hands, you cut the probability of being outplayed in the pot.

[scweeber]

limping very often can be a very sound strategy in the low-limit NLH games i play in around here... i've found that letting the other (weaker) players raise gives me an edge in these games. sounds strange but if anyone is interested i'll explain...

[Crocolyle]

I always think of the general idea that aggression is usually rewarded when playing NL or PL Hold 'Em. When I play a hand I will tpyically bring it in for a raise to keep that aggressive image at the table. Granted you can't do this with every hand that you want to play, but usually my premium holdings and semi-premium holdings while in position will be brought in for a raise. Someone mentioned earlier that the type of players in the game will effect this which I agree with to a certain extent. Usually, with any sort of players, you can narrow it down to heads up or even three-way action. Most of the time (especially while in position) you can take the pot down immediately on the flop without much resistance from the other players. This way you're also getting the maximum value out of your holdings as well.So, basically, lost of button raising!...lol

[Big_Puke]

Limping in is a very good strategy, depending on position and your starting hand. If I am in an early position for example I may limp in with a mediocre hand like K10 os. If I get raised or the flop does not connect than I get out. By limping in, sometimes you hit the monster or two pair with a rainbow flop and you can accumulate alot of chips this way.This is not a hard and fast rule and I do not always do this. A lot depends on table composition, position and other variables.

[53o]

For context, a little about my backround... I live in Vegas and only play in live games at casinos, usually on weekends. I never play tournaments, only limit cash games.I usually play 2-4 and at some tables all you'll get is limpers.. Some people will actually get upset when you habitually raise pre flop... At tables like this, where you can count on not getting raised before the flop, I usually extend the number of hands that I'll play from early position and limp on almost anything in late position. You just have to realize that you can't bluff tables like this, when there are from 5-9 people seeing the flop on a regular basis and you miss, someone else didn't. Even when you stay in on good hands, like Big Slick.. if you don't hit, someone else did and you'll be drawing from behind against a pair of 5's, and that person will call/bet his 5's all the way to the river (even if every other card on the board is an over)I call these tables 'tourist tables'. The thing is most people new to poker don't feel like they're really playing poker unless they are seeing flops... At tables like these the money is mostly dead money, provided you can get the cards and then hit flops with them. It can be pretty frustrating if you're not hitting and watching hands like 24off win three times in a row (actually happened recently). You also have to watch your stack, as it's easy to limp/blind away your whole stack at a table like this waiting to hit.Wow.. Kinda strayed there a bit.. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it really depends on the table and situation. When you say limp, to me that means trying to see a flop cheaply with a weak hand. If there is typically very little pre flop action at your table then its safer to do this. If you have people at your table that are betting a lot before the flop, just make sure you have position on them when you try it.