7 replies to this topic

[craiger]

I can't believe I've never thought of this before...

but when deciding whether or not to call based on pot odds (i realise there are more factors, but just for ease of discussion...)
do you calculate the chances of hitting your outs on the turn AND the river...or just each street independently??

For example...

You hold KQ of clubs.
Flop comes A 4 8, two clubs. Your read for some reason, tells you that villain has an ace. You have 9 outs.
The pot is $4, villain bets $2. You are getting 3 to 1 on a call. You're about 35% to hit the flush on the turn or river (odds that justify a call) BUT only 20% to hit the flush on the turn alone.

Which set of odds do you use here, the turn AND river, or just the present street, the turn??

thanks in advance.

[Zach6668]

One street at a time.

You use the two street thing when you are figuring your equity. Ie, should you jam your flush draw in a 5 way pot on the flop? You have 35% equity and you're putting in 20% of the money, so yes.

You can also start to factor in the second street when you think about implied odds.

[blakheart]

Zach is right in terms of limit games. In NL, it is often correct to think in terms of effective stack sizes when making these decisions. What amount of chips may you have to risk to make your hand? What amount of chips might you win if you make your hand?

Simplest situation, You need to call $20 of your $30 stack into a $100 pot to try to catch your flush after the flop. The math is really your $30 dollar stack vrs. the pot.

[Frez]

One street at a time, unless you are going all in so you know you're seeing the last two cards without putting in any more money.

You play home games around Edmonton?

[jmbreslin]

I read something a while ago (might have been in one of John Vorhaus's books) where he said that one of the biggest mistakes that inexperienced NLHE players make is calculating their outs to complete by the river rather than on the next card. You can't calculate more than one street at a time unless you know you're going to see both cards.

[craiger]

One street at a time, unless you are going all in so you know you're seeing the last two cards without putting in any more money.

You play home games around Edmonton?

Thanks for the help everyone...I felt retarded asking that, given the fact that I've read about 6 poker books and have been playing for 5 years now. I just always used the "oh, I'm 35% to hit my flush, I call the turn".

Yeah me and mostly work friends have a home game about once every 2 weeks. we actually had one last night...turned out to be the biggest one ever. $30 buy-in with unlimited re-buys until the 100/200 level. First place took down over $200. Too bad my A-10 ran into a K-10

[TheWanderer]

Switch to no-limit so you can just push all-in.

[Zach6668]

Switch to no-limit so you can just push all-in.

I can already tell you're gonna be very valuable to this forum....