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Qq Vs A Dry Board


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#1 cwik

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 01:14 AM

Just sat down so no reads/statsFull Tilt PokerNo Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $1/$26 playersConverterStack sizes:UTG: $219.95Hero: $194CO: $65.45Button: $135.10SB: $303.45BB: $174Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG+1 with :) :club: UTG raises to $7, Hero raises to $24, 2 folds, SB calls, 2 folds.Flop: :D :D :D ($57, 2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $38, SB calls.Turn: :D ($133, 2 players)SB bets $40, Hero ???

#2 navybuttons

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 02:32 AM

i say call. also, i'm totally gonna fold a non-queen river if he makes a reasonable bet.
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#3 krup24

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 04:28 AM

pretty tough spot with the donk bet. i love preflop and the size of your flop bet. i play AA and a set like this sometimes if i am villian. i would say its read dependent. its either a blocker for AJ or a monster. i don't think he calls preflop with AJ. getting > 5:1 makes it seem like a bleeder to me i probably let it go but I'm sure calling and reevaluating river is fine.edit: now that i see our remaining stack i can fold a bid easier
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#4 Temporary Nuts

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 05:34 AM

View Postnavybuttons, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 6:32 AM, said:

i say call. also, i'm totally gonna fold a non-queen river if he makes a reasonable bet.
FAILThis looks like a blocker bet more than a setup bet. Honestly though, he bets less than a third of the pot why are we reacting like an overpair is no good in six max on a rainbow board with not completed straights out there?Call this down, and call down any non-A non-J river.
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#5 Andromeda

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 05:49 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 9:34 AM, said:

This looks like a blocker bet more than a setup bet. Honestly though, he bets less than a third of the pot why are we reacting like an overpair is no good in six max on a rainbow board with not completed straights out there?Call this down, and call down any non-A non-J river.
I agree with this...if anything, I maybe raise the turn to see if he really has anything he feels like chasing. His bet seems weak to me.

#6 Zach6668

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 05:53 AM

We have ~$130 left, wtf are you raising to?
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#7 Andromeda

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 05:58 AM

View PostZach6668, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 9:53 AM, said:

We have ~$130 left, wtf are you raising to?
if he calls, that leaves Hero with only $92 and SB had us covered from the beginning. I didn't do the math before (donkey move on my part) but if I was going to raise, why not just push all-in?the way I am seeing this is that I am not folding QQ - so that means calling or raising and if I call, I am pretty much pot committed (~2/3 of Hero's stack is in the pot). If I can take down the pot now because villain doesn't hold AA, KK, or a set, I am willing to take that chance.

#8 krup24

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 06:02 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 9:34 AM, said:

This looks like a blocker bet more than a setup bet. Honestly though, he bets less than a third of the pot why are we reacting like an overpair is no good in six max on a rainbow board with not completed straights out there?Call this down, and call down any non-A non-J river.
FAILi think the only blocker bet is AJ which is limited based on pf action and if we call the $40 the rest of our stack is going in on the river everytime.
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#9 Zach6668

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 06:08 AM

View PostAndromeda, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 9:58 AM, said:

if he calls, that leaves Hero with only $92 and SB had us covered from the beginning. I didn't do the math before (donkey move on my part) but if I was going to raise, why not just push all-in?the way I am seeing this is that I am not folding QQ - so that means calling or raising and if I call, I am pretty much pot committed (~2/3 of Hero's stack is in the pot). If I can take down the pot now because villain doesn't hold AA, KK, or a set, I am willing to take that chance.
But if you're going to fold worse hands, and only get called by KK/AA, then shoving is clearly bad....
QUOTE (serge @ Tuesday, May 12th, 2009, 7:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
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#10 Andromeda

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 06:11 AM

View PostZach6668, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 10:08 AM, said:

But if you're going to fold worse hands, and only get called by KK/AA, then shoving is clearly bad....
So do what then? Call the Turn, fold the river to a bet?

#11 Zach6668

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 06:12 AM

View PostAndromeda, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 10:11 AM, said:

So do what then? Call the Turn, fold the river to a bet?
Prolly call/call, let him v-bet a worse hand, or bluff off, or whatever.I'm sure some guys you can fold turn, or at worst river vs, but I dunno.
QUOTE (serge @ Tuesday, May 12th, 2009, 7:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
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QUOTE (Acid_Knight @ Monday, March 10th, 2008, 4:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Zach is right about pretty much everything.

#12 Andromeda

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 06:17 AM

View PostZach6668, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 10:12 AM, said:

Prolly call/call, let him v-bet a worse hand, or bluff off, or whatever.I'm sure some guys you can fold turn, or at worst river vs, but I dunno.
specifically to this hand, is this because of the lack of read/knowledge of the villain?

#13 Next3124

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 06:40 AM

In this case. I think you should raise him. With QQ. Guy might had AJ or maybe even 88 or 10-10. He might think you had AK AQ and he check the flop. But normally if you had JJ you would have checked the flop. So. I guess Hero Should be raising him. It sound like a steal or maybe he got a hand but not a big one. Cause if he had your overpair beaten he would have tryed a check-raise on turn . Because Hero bet on flop. So the best option here would be to raise him!"

#14 StPong

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 07:03 AM

I think this is 88 - JJ. KK and AA are possible, but with a re-raise in front of him pf I don't see why the villain wouldn't push the action and expect to get called.My vote is call, and like Nuts said, call any non-J, non-A river. I don't like a raise because you're only getting called by hands that beat you since there's no reasonable draw.

#15 mln_falcon

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 07:03 AM

Call. call bet on river barring J and if he checks, check behind due to lack of reads.

#16 mtdesmoines

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 07:22 AM

View Postcwik, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 1:14 AM, said:

Turn: :club: ($133, 2 players)SB bets $40, Hero ???
It's jacks. It played just like jacks. You're drawing to a Q. His turn bet is designed to get you committed to the pot. Fold. And if it's not jacks, it's surely overs. Fold.
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#17 StPong

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 08:42 AM

View Postmtdesmoines, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 10:22 AM, said:

It's jacks. It played just like jacks. You're drawing to a Q. His turn bet is designed to get you committed to the pot. Fold. And if it's not jacks, it's surely overs. Fold.
By the same token, it could be TT seeing if Hero will commit himself to the pot or fold. I'm really not sure about this hand...I think 88 through JJ could all play this way.

#18 shinzilla

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 08:52 AM

lol lol lolsome of you guys would be so exploitable. why are you guys so scared? this is a blocking bet so often. call the turn and most rivers if bet, and bet the river if checked to.
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#19 Temporary Nuts

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 09:00 AM

View Postkrup24, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 8:28 AM, said:

edit: now that i see our remaining stack i can fold a bid easier
Don't even attempt to fail me. This is a horrific fold. ZOMG!!! Less than a third of the pot!!!! BETTAR FOLD ME OVERPAIR ON DA SAFAST BOARD EVAR AT 6 MAX!Edit: The amount of people wanting to make a hero fold here makes me want to vomit.
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#20 shinzilla

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Posted 25 October 2007 - 09:03 AM

View PostTemporary Nuts, on Thursday, October 25th, 2007, 10:00 AM, said:

Don't even attempt to fail me. This is a horrific fold. ZOMG!!! Less than a third of the pot!!!! BETTAR FOLD ME OVERPAIR ON DA SAFAST BOARD EVAR AT 6 MAX!
lol
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