8 replies to this topic

[Mattnxtc]

Full Tilt Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.25/$0.5
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $4.70
UTG+1: $6.70
CO: $10.75
Mattnxtc: $10.30
SB: $3.75
BB: $10

Pre-flop: (6 players) Mattnxtc is Button with K A
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, CO folds, Mattnxtc raises, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds.

Flop: J 8 T (9SB, 4 players)
SB bets, BB calls, UTG calls, Mattnxtc raises, SB calls, BB calls, UTG folds.

Turn: A (8BB, 3 players)
SB bets, BB calls, Mattnxtc raises, SB calls, BB calls.

River: 4 (14BB, 3 players)
SB bets, BB folds, Mattnxtc ????


Villian: 70/10/2.4

Common theme of tonight is my river action.

SB has donked out all 3 times. I think up until the river it is pretty standard right? Whats my river action against constant donk bets?

[Zach6668]

Call with marginal hands like TPTK on the river, imo. If you get a better read of exactly what he donks with, AND will call a raise with (although I suspect his range ends somewhere around Q-high, lol), then we can raise TPTK.

[CoranMoran]

Villain led the flop into the Preflop raiser.
This represents strength.
He then called our raise.

An Ace hits the turn.
This is the most likely card to help us.
Yet Villain shows that he is not afraid of this fact and leads into us again.
And calls our raise once more.

He is not bluffing here.
He can never expect that both we and the 3rd player will fold now.
He is betting because he likes his hand.

We are raising because our hand is good and has the potential to be great (if we hit our nut Flush Draw).

Villain once again bets into us on the river.
3 donk-bets and 2 raises thus far against 2 opponents typically represents great strength.
This is how I would sometimes play the nuts from out of position in order to keep the 3rd player along for the ride.

Out TPTK is still good.
But our Flush Draw no longer has a chance to get there.
So our hand is no longer great.
And against so much aggression, our 1-pair does not warrant another raise, in my opinion.

I see this river as an easy call.


--CM

[Zach6668]

Coran, you are over estimating this villain, a bit.

I know in general, you are correct, but villain donk bluffing all three streets is not out of the realm of possibility. He's 71/10/2.4 He's not a good player, nor is he a thinking player.

His donk doesn't mean strength always. It's such a huge range of crap.

Same with the turn.

[Mattnxtc]

Coran...I do like your analysis a lot. Unfortunately I dont think it is applicable at this level of play all that often. For reference villian showed a7o no spades.

I did end up just flat calling the river, but with the way he played this hand I was just completely confused on it.

[Zach6668]

The river really is just a call, because you'd need to be ahead 2/3 of the time.

I agree with the turn raise, and obv the flop play at this level, and lots of the time at my level.

[Moneyball16]

The river really is just a call, because you'd need to be ahead 2/3 of the time.

I agree with the turn raise, and obv the flop play at this level, and lots of the time at my level.

I agree thats its just a call, but I dont think we need to be ahead 2/3 of the time here to make this a correct raise. Doesn't the whole 2/3 thing come into play when we will be 3-bet by all the hands that beat us, but in this spot I don't think villain is 3-betting two pair and even some sets.

[Zach6668]

Ya, that's right. I suppose some of the lesser two pair hands might now 3-bet, or perhaps bottom set or something.

I actually just confused the crap out of myself, and I can't even think of why we need to be ahead 2/3....

I guess it's cuz we lose 2 additional bets, to earn just 1, right?

Yah, I get it again. Mental lapse.

[Sheiky]

What did your instincts tell you he had?

If he's a passive player who would probably only bet that much with two pair or a set, it's a call, if he's a retard and you don't put him on anything, i would trust my instincts and raise. Judging by those numbers it's probably the latter, but calling is fine.

The way he played this hand doesn't really make sense to me, if he had you beat i reckon he would have raised on the flop, the way he played it leads me to think he had a nothing hand on the flop and hit the ace on the turn(though tbf i did read the result). My advice is to really think whether you are ahead or not and don't be afraid to raise if you think you are, i think it will make you a better player in the long run.