13 replies to this topic

[jmbreslin]

Villain was a fairly laggy individual, who was pretty active with his chips on the bubble. I really struggle with these kinds of hands on the bubble, not knowing whether to play them as hard as I usually would or whether to be more cautious because it's the bubble. I tend to opt for caution, but then it often forces me into difficult decisions. Advice requested on all streets.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (4 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB (t4300)
Hero (t2220)
Button (t4815)
SB (t2165)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J, A.
Hero raises to t300, Button calls t300, 2 folds.

Flop: (t825) 8, J, K (2 players)
Hero bets t300, Button raises to t600, Hero calls t300.

Turn: (t2025) K (2 players)
Hero checks, Button checks.

River: (t2025) Q (2 players)
Hero bets t150, Button raises to t3915, Hero ???

[GCP]

Push flop. Either lead out all-in or reraise all-in.

[Yahkin]

I raise more PF...probably 450. Pushing PF isn't bad either. I will happily take the blinds here.

Push the flop.
As played, I check the river too and hope he checks behind. I probably fold to a push and open shove ATC next hand. His flop raise, and then check behind on the turn with the second King really tells me he is sitting on a K.

[thebottomline]

For me:

Raise more PF - making it between 450 - 600 is good for me normally, but with your stack I'd say 450. With just the min you're pricing too many people in.

Bet more on the flop - with 825 in the pot and you with 1920 left I'd bet around 500 and shove to a raise.

Shove on the raise.

See what happens. Based on the action after the flop it seems like you're beat for sure, but I would have been happy to bust getting it in with that hand on that flop around the bubble. Even if he has K8 you're at 49/51 and if he has KJ you're 45/55. Not a bad spot for me at all.

[sabes99]

don't minraise pf...just don't do it, ever

if you're going to lead out, bet a little more, maybe 400-500, or go for the c/r...if he checks behind you get a free card off, and if he bets you can go ahead and get your money in...i would just shove the flop after the minraise as played, since you're never folding

i am just curious...why would you make the minimum bet on the end like that? was it a blocker bet? if so, i think making the bet is unnecessary in this particular spot, i think it's quite obvious that he's got something based on the play of the hand...would he really minraise the flop and then check the turn with a flush draw? i don't think so...since the top pair card paired on the turn, i would really expect him to have a full house or trips here most of the time, so i think you would have been better off to c/f the end

[jmbreslin]

Thanks guys. So there is consensus on (1) raising more PF; and (2) getting it all in on the flop. So even though we're on the bubble and I'm likely behind (even if just by a small margin), I should be prepared to go for broke here?

The pathetic river bet was kind of a blocker/probe bet. Often at $1.20 players will take a stab at the pot on the river with a wide range of hands, including bluffs. Although he obviously has something here I was hoping if I threw out a small bet he might be inclined just to call it down.

[sabes99]

Thanks guys. So there is consensus on (1) raising more PF; and (2) getting it all in on the flop. So even though we're on the bubble and I'm likely behind (even if just by a small margin), I should be prepared to go for broke here?

yea, you're pretty short on chips, you can't just be folding to have any chance to win

[Cappy37]

Thanks guys. So there is consensus on (1) raising more PF; and (2) getting it all in on the flop. So even though we're on the bubble and I'm likely behind (even if just by a small margin), I should be prepared to go for broke here?

The pathetic river bet was kind of a blocker/probe bet. Often at $1.20 players will take a stab at the pot on the river with a wide range of hands, including bluffs. Although he obviously has something here I was hoping if I threw out a small bet he might be inclined just to call it down.

Well, it is a $1.20. The problem with pushing the flop is you are going to get called by hands that beat you, and whole lotta hands with a shot at beating you.

Checking the turn is the cardinal sin here. His min re-raise on that flop means one of two things: AA/KK, or he's on a draw. I don't give him credit for smooth calling with Aces here, so I'm putting him on a draw. Checking that turn lets him draw for free, and then you dark tunnelled less than 10% of the pot on the river on what appears to be 1/3 the proper size of a blocker bet.

That river bet isn't large enough to block anything, won't get called by a missed draw, and may even get popped by air, which you probably cannot call anyways. Did you actually pay to get to see his 10-9?

[jmbreslin]

No, I folded it. In my experience $1.20 players never raise with a draw, unless it's a huge one. They will sometimes lead with a small bet, but a raise usually means a made hand of some sort. Especially the minraise. So I figured I was most likely behind a K, and that's why I decided to slow down on the turn. If my assumption about the raise not being a draw is correct, then I'm either WA or WB on the turn. The check behind actually fits a K holding pretty well at this level of play - he sensed weakness in my check, and he didn't want to scare me off when he hit his trips. So he checks behind to feign weakness, planning to either raise my river lead or lead out himself.

If both streets had been checked through, that river raise could be a bluff or semi-bluff attempt. But combined with the flop minraise, it's more likely to be a strong hand masquerading as a bluff/semi-bluff.

[Cappy37]

I've been finding the PF mini-raises to be a lot more of the suited connector variety than the big hand variety lately in the $1.20s..

I've seen an awful lot of min-raising on draws, too. Might want to look out for it.

[cdannons]

In single tables tournaments, the play obviosuly dramatically changes at the final 4. When you and one other person are the low stacks, caution is right. You don't wanna fight too much with the big stacks. Although, you can't just not play this hand. So, I like raising, but I hate the min raise. I don't know if that was somehting you were doing a lot before the final 4, but that looks to me like somebody who is afraid to put money in because they wanna make the money. I say 3 big blinds is the way to go. The flop is where it gets really interesting. Do you bet, shove, or check? Betting will give you a chance to win the pot right now while still giving you a chance if your called. Shoving will maximize the chance he folds while getting called will leave you ok too. And checking is interesting, if he bets, you can shove! This would put the pressure on him well trying to get the chips. If he checks back, then you know your hand is proabbly best without having risked any of your chips. Also, you arn't too scared of giving a free card here. Only something like a Q that isn't a spade would be scary. I really like the check. I think if you are going to bet, you should have bet more. These stupid big stack like to call small bets after calling a raise preflop, regardless of the flop. this keeps you in a difficult situation. I don't think I would fault a shove. Bet like I said, I like the check. The turn was not a scary card, if he has you beat now, he had you beat before. In fact, it's a good card, it lowers the chance he has a K. Part of my likes the check but I think it's just too weak. I would fire again, a bigger bet, your hand is probably best. The river is the move I really hate. There is absolutely no reason to bet there. That Q was a bad card for you. Also, by betting that minimum, you're inviting a big raise. What is the point of this bet? Maybe you will be called by like a pair of 8s. But really, you're not being called by anything that you can beat. the onyl reason I can see to bet is to prevent him from making a bigger bet that you won't know weather to call or not. If this was the case, 300 seems like a good amount. You raised 300 preflop, bet 300 on the flop, so now a 300 bet isn't too suspicious. But I would definately say check here and see what happens. If he bets big, you can still get away from the hand. If he bets a reasonable amount, maybe it wil be worth a call, maybe. This is actually a really tough situation brought on by a lack of effot to figure things out earlier in the hand. By making weak bets and checks, you give away that you don't know what's going on and make these aggressive plays easy for your opponents. Play aggressively and force them to give you information during the hand

[cdannons]

and btw, i agree with folding at the end, live to fight another day

[Cappy37]

^^^^^^^^^

I swear on my life that I didn't make a 2nd account just to agree with myself.

This is not me, your honor!

[timwakefield]

You should just make a standard 3x raise PF and probably go broke if somebody shoves on you. The flop is absolutely perfect for you, definitely definitely definitely like suuuuuuuuuper definitely go broke there every single time. You HAVE to shove on his minraise if you like money.