99 In The Bb, 2nd Hour Of A $22 180

[ChrisRichey 1]

I have been very aggressive recently, since the seond hour is so critical to going deep. What do you think?PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)UTG+1 (t3055)MP1 (t7225)MP2 (t4224)CO (t3225)Button (t5134)SB (t5887)Hero (t6875)UTG (t5472)Preflop: Hero is BB with 9, 9. 6 folds, SB raises to t800, Hero raises to t6875

[simo_8ball 0]

Looks about standard. SB has a huge range over which you are a favourite. You want as much fold equity as possible. Push seems the obvious answer.I don't hate calling with position and seeing a flop, but I prefer pushing.

[STYLINHAWYN 0]

yeah, pushing seems like your best option here. If he has 2 over cards, he has a really tough time calling an all-in raise unless he has AK... and even then... your the slight favorite. He could also have an underpair to your 99, where you are a 4-1 favorite... if he's retarded enough to call you with a pair lower than 9's. you may even get him to fold a hand like 1010...I don't think he has a big pair QQ-AA... a raise from the sb of 4x the big blind just doesn't say he has a big pair, typically you try to price them in with any of the big hands in that position. take a chance to double up and get the monster stack in the tourey, or be satisfied taking the pot down preflop.

[caribstv 0]

yeah, pushing seems like your best option here. If he has 2 over cards, he has a really tough time calling an all-in raise unless he has AK... and even then... your the slight favorite. He could also have an underpair to your 99, where you are a 4-1 favorite... if he's retarded enough to call you with a pair lower than 9's. you may even get him to fold a hand like 1010...I don't think he has a big pair QQ-AA... a raise from the sb of 4x the big blind just doesn't say he has a big pair, typically you try to price them in with any of the big hands in that position. take a chance to double up and get the monster stack in the tourey, or be satisfied taking the pot down preflop.

I don't get it here.......he raised yes out of the blind but he can still wake up with a bigger pair in his hand.....I would call and see what the flop brings.. you're first in chips why risk all your chips on two 99's I Hate going out like that.. but thats just me... if he has AJ or better he's calling... KQ or better he's calling.... Any bigger pair he's calling so we'll be either a slight favorite (at a coin flip) or a BIG underdogand we're first in chips.... is this the spot u wanna go with??

[simo_8ball 0]

I don't get it here.......he raised yes out of the blind but he can still wake up with a bigger pair in his hand.....

I wouldn't expect AA-QQ to raise to 800. Seems a little much. This bet looks a lot like a mid pair in the range 66-TT.The other factor is that the pot is already 1000. Taking this preflop is good.With 99, there is about an 85% chance of at least one overcard falling on the flop. If we just call we let him catch with a weak hand. We also let him bluff us off an ace high flop with something like 77.If we push preflop we may get calls from underpairs, which would fold to a bet/raise from us on the flop.I prefer pushing.

[caribstv 0]

I wouldn't expect AA-QQ to raise to 800. Seems a little much. This bet looks a lot like a mid pair in the range 66-TT.The other factor is that the pot is already 1000. Taking this preflop is good.With 99, there is about an 85% chance of at least one overcard falling on the flop. If we just call we let him catch with a weak hand. We also let him bluff us off an ace high flop with something like 77.If we push preflop we may get calls from underpairs, which would fold to a bet/raise from us on the flop.I prefer pushing.

Out come will be the same Depending on your post flop play.... however.. being in the sm blind allows a over bet supiciuos looking play and the player calls thinking the Sm is trying to run me over but turns over Aces or Kingshowever I'm talking about playing agaist the second largest stack at the tableI'm sure he's not coming at you with nothing..Agaist smaller stacks yes i would be pushing as well

[Actuary 3]

read on SB would be nice.How has he palyed his big hands/pairs? Mid pairs?what does he normally do when it's folded to him? In SB ?I don't think implied oddds are there to call.We aren't hitting and him hitting enough to get back the 600, if we play no set no bet. And being BB, we won't get the chance to fire first into a safe flop.I'm leaning to fold and not tangling with another big stack here at this time.But it's close imo

[copernicus 0]

tough one. Hes got a wide range, but hes got a big stack. I definitely cant see folding here so the choices areCall and play it for set or an underpair/undercard flopRaise and try to get him out cheaplyPush, which has to have a lot of fold equity.Since we have position on him I opt for calling.

[Actuary 3]

darnI'm wrong again.

[copernicus 0]

darnI'm wrong again.

No...I just like post flop play a little more than you do!

[Actuary 3]

No...I just like post flop play a little more than you do!

Actually in an MTT, I'd lean to push this, more than fold.I do have a STT -get to bubble mind set too much.Calling, yeah, I'd be concerned I was putting in chips behind on any non 9 flopSo I might stab if checked to on a good flop and shut down after wardsLately it's been really bad. I'm always like 1600 vs 6000 vs 4400 and 50/100 blinds all the time Maybe I need to open up somewhere earlier.[/hijack]

[AK33 0]

I skimmed through this so maybe someone already mentioned this but you seem to be overlooking one thing: POSITION! You have position on this guy, why not reraise pre-flop to something that will really make him think. You don't have to set him all in, you can accomplish the same goal with a lesser bet. Wait and see what he does on the flop. Use your position.

[copernicus 0]

I skimmed through this so maybe someone already mentioned this but you seem to be overlooking one thing: POSITION! You have position on this guy, why not reraise pre-flop to something that will really make him think. You don't have to set him all in, you can accomplish the same goal with a lesser bet. Wait and see what he does on the flop. Use your position.

I mentioned position, and the reason you dont reraise is that it reduces the benefit of position.1 it reveals more about the strength of your hand. you are no longer just defending your blind, so it narrows the range he puts you on, inhibits him from a continuation bet, which you may love to see with the right flop, and reduces the chances that he makes a mistake.2 it increases the size of the pot making it more tempting for him to make a play for the pot, and your hand is vulnerable to being pushed out with so many overcard possibilities3 it makes it harder for you to get away from with a mildly threatening flop4 it reduces the size of the stacks left behind, reducing flexibility (though stacks here are probably deep enough that this isnt an issue until the river if you get that far)5 it gives him the ability to pop you back preflop, which puts negates his positional disadvantage and is clearly his best play with AK, AQ...the hands that you want to be up against to take advantage of position.the major benefit of raising less than a push is to pick up the pot now with somehwhat less risk, as you point out. Does that goal offset all of the above with so little in the pot?

[AK33 0]

I mentioned position, and the reason you dont reraise is that it reduces the benefit of position.1 it reveals more about the strength of your hand. you are no longer just defending your blind, so it narrows the range he puts you on, inhibits him from a continuation bet, which you may love to see with the right flop, and reduces the chances that he makes a mistake.The right flop will not come often enough in this case. Any continuation bet makes it difficult to call with 2 or more over cards on the flop and any mistake he makes by betting a hand he shouldn't would be difficult to call out.2 it increases the size of the pot making it more tempting for him to make a play for the pot, and your hand is vulnerable to being pushed out with so many overcard possibilitiesMaking it more tempting to play for the top sounds like a mistake he might make, which is welcome in this case again only for with the right flop. While taking control of the hand and waiting for flop action gives you much more information about his hand, more information gives you more tools to then draw the correct conclusion.3 it makes it harder for you to get away from with a mildly threatening flopI still don't see how a good player can't lay this down, the more pressure you put on your opponent and the more he pushes back shows more strengh in his hand, making it easier to lay down in my mind.4 it reduces the size of the stacks left behind, reducing flexibility (though stacks here are probably deep enough that this isnt an issue until the river if you get that far)You said it yourself, not really an issue unless you go to the river, again gather information should prevent you from going that far unless you get the right clues and push him out earlier.5 it gives him the ability to pop you back preflop, which puts negates his positional disadvantage and is clearly his best play with AK, AQ...the hands that you want to be up against to take advantage of position.Well in this case, if he shows that kind of confidence I doubt he has AQ or even AK. Most players I see can't make this play with AK, they have to have QQ or better. If he pushes back you let go of the hand while only costing you your reraise instead of doubling him up if you simply push.the major benefit of raising less than a push is to pick up the pot now with somehwhat less risk, as you point out. Does that goal offset all of the above with so little in the pot?

Don't get me wrong here, I most agree with your posts but this time I think you have more options than to simply push. Play small ball and learn from additional information when you can.GL

[simo_8ball 0]

Most players I see can't make this play with AK, they have to have QQ or better. If he pushes back you let go of the hand while only costing you your reraise instead of doubling him up if you simply push.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...showtopic=75246Similar scenario. The guy pushed with A3.

[Actuary 3]

while one example proves little, I support the idea that many villains push with AK/AQ here, espcially blind v blind

[simo_8ball 0]

The right flop will not come often enough in this case. Any continuation bet makes it difficult to call with 2 or more over cards on the flop and any mistake he makes by betting a hand he shouldn't would be difficult to call out.That's the main problem with calling. Not many flops look good for 99. We can easily be bluffed off by an underpair on most flops.I don't think a standard reraise is good. You can't fold to an allin once you reraise, and I prefer to get the extra fold equity and remove the possibility of the stop and go.Push.

[AK33 0]

The right flop will not come often enough in this case. Any continuation bet makes it difficult to call with 2 or more over cards on the flop and any mistake he makes by betting a hand he shouldn't would be difficult to call out.That's the main problem with calling. Not many flops look good for 99. We can easily be bluffed off by an underpair on most flops.I don't think a standard reraise is good. You can't fold to an allin once you reraise, and I prefer to get the extra fold equity and remove the possibility of the stop and go.Push.

You get the same fold equity with a healthy reraise and you can fold an all in depending on your read and whatever the pot is laying.An underpair is going to have a hard time bluffing into a reraise and a scary board.I guess I just prefer risking less to earn the same pot, if he reraises all in then at least you have the option of folding with more info. If he does reraise all in then chances are he would've called your all in also which leaves you in no better situation.

Most players I see can't make this play with AK, they have to have QQ or better. If he pushes back you let go of the hand while only costing you your reraise instead of doubling him up if you simply push.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...showtopic=75246Similar scenario. The guy pushed with A3.

You can't argue this case for case, my advice is general and should be taken into consideration along with many other factors, including aggressiveness, table image and a mirage of others.

[shpaget 0]

The right flop will not come often enough in this case. Any continuation bet makes it difficult to call with 2 or more over cards on the flop and any mistake he makes by betting a hand he shouldn't would be difficult to call out.That's the main problem with calling. Not many flops look good for 99. We can easily be bluffed off by an underpair on most flops.I don't think a standard reraise is good. You can't fold to an allin once you reraise, and I prefer to get the extra fold equity and remove the possibility of the stop and go.Push.

Let him stop'n'go...if I raise to 2000 and he calls and then leads at the flop I'm calling/pushing any board that doesn't have an ace.A push will, in most cases, lose hands like 66-88...a raise, CAN, on occassion get them to come along. A push will not cause a better hand to fold...once in a blue moon TT will fold in this tournament, but that's about it.A push will drop hands like A8s...A raise might get him to go along for the ride.

[simo_8ball 0]

Let him stop'n'go...if I raise to 2000 and he calls and then leads at the flop I'm calling/pushing any board that doesn't have an ace.A push will, in most cases, lose hands like 66-88...a raise, CAN, on occassion get them to come along. A push will not cause a better hand to fold...once in a blue moon TT will fold in this tournament, but that's about it.A push will drop hands like A8s...A raise might get him to go along for the ride.

If we reraise to $2k, the pot will be $4k on the flop and we will be looking at at least one overcard 85% of the time. I don't like that prospect. I'd rather put the pressure on him.Maybe it's just me.

[AK33 0]

If we reraise to $2k, the pot will be $4k on the flop and we will be looking at at least one overcard 85% of the time. I don't like that prospect. I'd rather put the pressure on him.Maybe it's just me.

I'd worry about the flop after he acts.

[copernicus 0]

Don't get me wrong here, I most agree with your posts but this time I think you have more options than to simply push. Play small ball and learn from additional information when you can.GL

I think you misunderstood me, I am advocating small ball on this hand...and the better small ball play is calling and not raising, for the reasons I stated.Nothing in the posts after yours are at all convincing.

[AK33 0]

I think you misunderstood me, I am advocating small ball on this hand...and the better small ball play is calling and not raising, for the reasons I stated.Nothing in the posts after yours are at all convincing.

Whatever works for you. I think good arguments can be made both ways. I like to raise to see how my opponents respond.

[copernicus 0]

Whatever works for you. I think good arguments can be made both ways. I like to raise to see how my opponents respond.

thats more important OOP. His action ahead of you on the flop tells you as much or more, and for free. With deeper stacks the arguements for raising become a bit more persuausive.the best argument for raising hasnt even been mentioned (that I saw anyway) which is that it may inhibit villain from leading on the flop, giving you a free look at 4th street. unfortunately that doesnt tell you much in most circumstances because you are looking at a 2 outer to really solidify your response to whatever he does on the turn. Eg two overcards flop (particularly an A), check, check, undercard turn, bet....pretty standard for Aces to check the flop here to not chase the market away unless its a coordinated board.

[AK33 0]

thats more important OOP. His action ahead of you on the flop tells you as much or more, and for free. With deeper stacks the arguements for raising become a bit more persuausive.the best argument for raising hasnt even been mentioned (that I saw anyway) which is that it may inhibit villain from leading on the flop, giving you a free look at 4th street. unfortunately that doesnt tell you much in most circumstances because you are looking at a 2 outer to really solidify your response to whatever he does on the turn. Eg two overcards flop (particularly an A), check, check, undercard turn, bet....pretty standard for Aces to check the flop here to not chase the market away unless its a coordinated board.

His action on the flop tells you nothing if you don't raise pre-flop. "...pretty standard for Aces to check the flop here to not chase the market away unless its a coordinated board" so he checks, could be a made hand, could be nothing.If he still leads at the pot with a reraise you can lay it down almost KNOWING you are beat, if he check and you lead and play after this basically tells you his hand, if he calls you slow down, if he raises you're done, and if he folds... well hey that's what we want.You want to either to collect the pot on the flop or get out if you reraise preflop. Without the reraise and a scary board you are betting in the dark or seeing a free card to hit a two outer?