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do i call the river?


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Do I call this river? And should I have played it any different?.50/.50 Pot Limit ($50 Max Buy In)I'm dealt Qh Qdmurr999 posts blind ($0.50), Tattoo Tom posts blind ($0.50).PRE-FLOPBDPoolie bets $1.50, Latta23 calls $1.50, Taiani folds, mromaha2 folds, kentk folds, rtomeara calls $1.50, --action-- folds, murr999 calls $1, Tattoo Tom folds.FLOP [board cards 10C,JS,QC ]murr999 checks, BDPoolie bets $3.50, Latta23 folds, rtomeara calls $3.50, murr999 folds.TURN [board cards 10C,JS,QC,2S ]BDPoolie bets $7, rtomeara calls $7.RIVER [board cards 10C,JS,QC,2S,4S ]BDPoolie bets $10, rtomeara bets $49.50 and is all-inDo I call All in with a Set of Queens?

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How big's your stack?Do you have any reads on your opponent?
Don't have any reads. Other guy only been in the room a few hands.I start the hand with about $68. He has about $60.
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By my quick and sometimes sketchy math you are getting about 2:1 on your call. It's possible that the villain has a flush or straight, but equally if not more likely that he has some two-pair combination or lower set.I'd call.If you had a read that he was weak/tight or passive, then I think you can consider folding.

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I did the same sketchy math as above, and your getting a really nice price on your money. I really don't think I'd call though. He played the hand pretty weak unless he has like the nut straight and club draw. I cant see him picking up the spades, but its possible to. Even the bad end of the straight is possible. Without anykind of read I'd fold.BTW, there isn't enough in the pot for him to be all in is there?

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I did the same sketchy math as above, and your getting a really nice price on your money. I really don't think I'd call though. He played the hand pretty weak unless he has like the nut straight and club draw. I cant see him picking up the spades, but its possible to. Even the bad end of the straight is possible. Without anykind of read I'd fold.BTW, there isn't enough in the pot for him to be all in is there?
Yes, he was all in. I took it straight from the hand history.Anyway, the result was:I put him on 2 pair. I thought there was no way he kept calling with the backdoor spade draw. He was actually calling with Qs-8s. I think he was pretty stupid to keep calling it down with top pair-bad kicker, but that's what he did, and hit the runner-runner spades.I thought for a long time and ended up calling it and losing $60+. I didn't know what else I could do after flopping top set. I guess I could have folded, but I think that would have been a tough fold for anyone.Oh well. Poker happens.
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My take on this is that you're beat.Doesn't mean I always fold this, cause sometimes I just can't do it....but generally, I figure 2 pair to raise the flop or the turn, not to wait for the river with that board. Any bets like this on the river and such a draw heavy board, probably mean you're beat.

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This hand is totally read depandant, but I would lean heavily towards calling unless I knew that my opponent couldn't be bluffing there. Especially when playing low limit online, your opponent could have a ton of hands you could beat:A) A busted straight drawB) Jacks and foursetc. So unless you REALLY have a good read on the guy, you have a hand that's too strong to just lay down.

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This hand is totally read depandant, but I would lean heavily towards calling unless I knew that my opponent couldn't be bluffing there. Especially when playing low limit online, your opponent could have a ton of hands you could beat:A) A busted straight drawB) Jacks and foursetc. So unless you REALLY have a good read on the guy, you have a hand that's too strong to just lay down.
yeah what he said. if the guy had just come to the table it would be tough to lay this hand down.
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This hand is totally read depandant, but I would lean heavily towards calling unless I knew that my opponent couldn't be bluffing there.  Especially when playing low limit online, your opponent could have a ton of hands  you could beat:A) A busted straight drawB) Jacks and foursetc.  So unless you REALLY have a good read on the guy, you have a hand that's too strong to just lay down.
Thanks. I felt pretty good about the call, but was just beat that time. Do you agree that his flop call and/or turn call was bad with top pair/weak kicker? Or did he have the right odds to call? Maybe if I'd bet more after the flop or turn then it may have pushed him out.
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you're giving him about 3 to 1 on his money on both the flop and turn here.on the flop, he's essentially drawing to 4 outs (the 9) - the inside straight draw with his Q8. not only is this a terrible play based on the small # of outs, those outs are potentially dirty since you could've raised with a K in your hand, making him the dummy end of the straight. i simply hate this play.on the turn, when he has the flush redraw, he's potentially got up to 13 outs assuming none of them are dirty. even if his gutshot straight outs are dirty, it's still 9 outs to a flush and the implied odds are potentially very good if you are also on a straight draw. since you're giving 3-1 again, i would probably call.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Alright, you can't assume that the villain has A K because he simply called in late position to you and another caller, i'd think that with A K the villain will attempt to raise. The only hands I see played like this are K 9 (once again a read would be nice here), or a hand like 10 J s (He could of simply called to be cautious a straight card didn't come up. A set is what I put him on, perhaps 1010 or JJ, I don't put him on any other set because he wouldn't of called the flop bet with under pockets on such a dangerous board. You are getting 2.2:1 on your money and the only hand that beats you out of the possibilities is the K 9. I wouldn't be too worried about a flush (it was runner runner, this would contradict his flop call). So I think would call, especially since it is a cash game and not a tournament.P.S. I didn't see the results when I was replying. I like to keep the bias of knowing what happened out of my response. After reading what happened, that's just bad luck and a stupid play on his part on the flop and preflop.

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I think this was a good call. I just won't put my opponent on hitting a backdoor flush draw unless it's a huge overbet because it's so unlikely. Most of the time, it's just a missed draw betting the scare card. If a club came off, I might have played the river differently, but this looks more like a missed draw than spades that hit.

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I don't play PL a lot, but that's a hand where I bet the pot on the flop, or check-raise a pot-sized bet, hoping to get everything all-in (or all out) before a 4-straight or 3rd club hit the board. I'd hate to see a bad turn card and then be faced with someone else's pot bet, holding a possible 10-outer. Me no likey evil flop. :club:

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I would have to lean toward folding here......Why would he raise all in here unless he had you beat. He would almost certainly just call with 2 pair with the straight and backdoor flush out there. I would say he either flopped a straight (very likely) or missed his club flush, which I would think he would have been a little more aggressive with if he was planning on trying to buy it if he didnt hit. Its a hard play to make with no read on the player, but I think you are beat and I would fold. As far as how you played the hand up to this point I think you played it well, its tough to be out of position on this hand because he was probably just milking his straight, while you were trying to make him pay for a draw.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I just started playing the 25nl games on party for that reload bonus I've been playing alot of tables at once I've seen that that the donk always has it a big river bets and min raises unless you've seen them messing around a few times already

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I think this was a good call. I just won't put my opponent on hitting a backdoor flush draw unless it's a huge overbet because it's so unlikely. Most of the time, it's just a missed draw betting the scare card. If a club came off, I might have played the river differently, but this looks more like a missed draw than spades that hit.
You can't overbet the pot in PL games, only the size of the pot.
Thanks. I felt pretty good about the call, but was just beat that time. Do you agree that his flop call and/or turn call was bad with top pair/weak kicker? Or did he have the right odds to call? Maybe if I'd bet more after the flop or turn then it may have pushed him out.
Yes, he made a dumb play. If he knew what you had, he'd have been nowhere near the hand.
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  • 3 weeks later...

I think you had to call the bet on the river, though I would not have done so happily. The problem you had with this hand, is that you did not bet strong enough earlier in the hand. I forgot what you bet preflop, but I dont believe it was a pot sized raise. Then when you flop top set, on that scary board, bet pot again, to make people pay to draw out on you. When the turn comes a blank, but makes a second flush draw, its time to bet pot again, and hope to take the pot down there. There are just oo many scare cards that could come on the river.

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I think you had to call the bet on the river, though I would not have done so happily. The problem you had with this hand, is that you did not bet strong enough earlier in the hand. I forgot what you bet preflop, but I dont believe it was a pot sized raise. Then when you flop top set, on that scary board, bet pot again, to make people pay to draw out on you. When the turn comes a blank, but makes a second flush draw, its time to bet pot again, and hope to take the pot down there. There are just oo many scare cards that could come on the river.
what he said.you don't even have to bet the whole pot to be giving the wrong odds on the suckout that happened to you, but if i remember the hand history and your bet sizes, you could have protected your hand against those draws a bit better.
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