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#3881 loogie

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Posted 17 October 2017 - 12:36 PM

View Postbrvheart, on 17 October 2017 - 12:34 PM, said:

Suicide isn't murder for one.

I can't think of a better way to describe it, actually.

#3882 Dubey

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Posted 17 October 2017 - 12:56 PM

View PostBalloon guy, on 12 October 2017 - 07:30 PM, said:



Multiply your population by 10 and your state/provident government agencies by 5, then have lobbyist, insurance companies and healthcare conglomerates write up a new plan and hand it to corrupt politicians and tell me we have a shot at something remotely able to work.


I'm not saying that it's even feasible in the USA, but this new argument that "actually, universal healthcare isn't even that good for the user, I mean, just look at Canada" is ridiculous, and is hugely counterproductive to there being any chance of it happening in the USA.

#3883 FCP Bob

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Posted 17 October 2017 - 02:12 PM

View Postbrvheart, on 17 October 2017 - 12:34 PM, said:

Suicide isn't murder for one.

increased suicides from guns is one of the major dangers from having guns in the home.
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#3884 brvheart

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Posted 17 October 2017 - 06:49 PM

View Postloogie, on 17 October 2017 - 12:36 PM, said:

I can't think of a better way to describe it, actually.

"the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another."

View PostiZuma, on 20 August 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

napa I was jesus christing suited, you guys just slipped in before me.

View PostEssay21, on 25 February 2013 - 08:32 PM, said:

.

#3885 loogie

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Posted 17 October 2017 - 07:39 PM

View Postbrvheart, on 17 October 2017 - 06:49 PM, said:

"the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another."

Suicide is murder for one.

Suicide.

Murder.

For one.

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#3886 FCP Bob

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Posted 18 October 2017 - 12:41 AM

View Postbrvheart, on 17 October 2017 - 06:49 PM, said:

"the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another."

how do we classify toddlers shooting people since they aren't old enough to be legally responsible.

American toddlers are still shooting people on a weekly basis this year
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#3887 loogie

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Posted Yesterday, 04:51 AM

[softly caresses microphone]

#3888 Dubey

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Posted Yesterday, 06:34 AM

the evolution of a pro-gun argument:

"guns don't kill people, people kill people!"

"The only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun!"

"That's ridiculous, this isn't the ONLY country where this regularly happens, stupid Onion."

"well if you take away this huge subset of gun deaths in America, we are kind of average if you squint at the numbers"

"By this definition right here, suicides aren't TECHNICALLY murder"

#3889 brvheart

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Posted Yesterday, 07:46 AM

I don't know why BG even mentioned taking out the suicides or gang shootings. Even with that stuff, we aren't even close to #1 like the liberal msm says we are.

View PostiZuma, on 20 August 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

napa I was jesus christing suited, you guys just slipped in before me.

View PostEssay21, on 25 February 2013 - 08:32 PM, said:

.

#3890 FCP Bob

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Posted Yesterday, 12:23 PM

View Postbrvheart, on 19 October 2017 - 07:46 AM, said:

I don't know why BG even mentioned taking out the suicides or gang shootings. Even with that stuff, we aren't even close to #1 like the liberal msm says we are.

the US is number 1 if compared to the countries that aren't failed states and are rich. Do you really want to be compared to Yemen or countries in Africa that have armed conflict in them ?
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#3891 brvheart

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Posted Yesterday, 01:20 PM

I wouldn't want to be racist against any people group. Violence is violence.

I also would have to jump through way too many logical hoops to get the US to #1. I would have to throw out most of South and Central America, which could be seen as racism. I would also have to throw out most of Africa, even South Africa, and that seems racist AND Westernized. So I'll just go with the actual numbers and see that the US is just the middle of the road (#94) for intentional homicides and know that anything else is just pushing a narrative that isn't based on reality.



https://en.wikipedia...l_homicide_rate


To BG's point though, if we legalized drugs, I would guess those numbers would plummet and be on par with Norway, France, and Canada. It would likely cause the homicide rates to fall all over South and Central America as well.

View PostiZuma, on 20 August 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

napa I was jesus christing suited, you guys just slipped in before me.

View PostEssay21, on 25 February 2013 - 08:32 PM, said:

.

#3892 FCP Bob

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Posted Yesterday, 01:29 PM

View Postbrvheart, on 19 October 2017 - 01:20 PM, said:

I wouldn't want to be racist against any people group. Violence is violence.

I also would have to jump through way too many logical hoops to get the US to #1. I would have to throw out most of South and Central America, which could be seen as racism. I would also have to throw out most of Africa, even South Africa, and that seems racist AND Westernized. So I'll just go with the actual numbers and see that the US is just the middle of the road (#94) for intentional homicides and know that anything else is just pushing a narrative that isn't based on reality.



https://en.wikipedia...l_homicide_rate


To BG's point though, if we legalized drugs, I would guess those numbers would plummet and be on par with Norway, France, and Canada. It would likely cause the homicide rates to fall all over South and Central America as well.

and the US is 11th in the World in firearms related deaths.

https://en.wikipedia...ated_death_rate

Just the fact that the guns exist and are in people's homes is the issue, it isn't just about murder. It's about suicides, and accidents and those homicial toddlers.

https://www.vox.com/...ics-maps-charts

5) States with more guns have more gun deaths

Posted Image

1) America has six times as many firearm homicides as Canada, and nearly 16 times as many as Germany

Posted Image
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#3893 brvheart

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Posted Yesterday, 01:33 PM

Considering that gun deaths aren't even close to the top 10 in causes of death in the US, I would say that it's not actually a big problem. Mental Health is a much bigger problem than guns.


Also, Vox and Mother Jones diagrams that push a narrative by only choosing items that will poison the well won't work on anyone but the most extreme liberal readers.

View PostiZuma, on 20 August 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

napa I was jesus christing suited, you guys just slipped in before me.

View PostEssay21, on 25 February 2013 - 08:32 PM, said:

.

#3894 Balloon guy

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Posted Yesterday, 06:51 PM

Posted Image


Gun ownership per capita world wide.

Canada has a lot more guns than most every other country ( except the US ....#1)

Why doesn't Canada have a higher gun deaths stat if it's availability of guns and gun ownership that causes gun deaths?
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#3895 FCP Bob

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Posted Yesterday, 07:05 PM

View PostBalloon guy, on 19 October 2017 - 06:51 PM, said:


Gun ownership per capita world wide.

Canada has a lot more guns than most every other country ( except the US ....#1)

Why doesn't Canada have a higher gun deaths stat if it's availability of guns and gun ownership that causes gun deaths?

Most of our guns are long guns not hand guns. Guns have a use as a tool for farmers for example for shooting vermin. Less than one in 15 people in Canada own guns and that number is far smaller in cities. People who do own guns here tend to own more than one.

Everybody who owns a gun legally in Canada had to past a fairly easy safety test and pass a background check to get a license. Without a license you aren't allowed to purchase or possess any guns or ammo.

A big difference is how our laws require guns to be stored. We don't consider self defense a valid reason for owning a gun so that means you have to store your guns in a locked gun locker or safe and they can't be loaded. It's also basically impossible to get a license to carry a gun especially hand guns. You have to obtain special permission for example to transport your unloaded hand gun from your home to the gun range for target practice.
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#3896 FCP Bob

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Posted Yesterday, 07:18 PM

Here are the regulations for storage for example.

In Canada their are 3 classes of guns. Prohibitied (think machine guns), restricted (hand guns and semi auto rifles), non-restricted ( shotguns and bolt action or lever action rifles)

Storage[edit]

Non-restricted firearms must be unloaded and either:
  • Made inoperable with a secure locking device (such as a trigger lock); or
  • Have bolts or bolt-carriers removed; or
  • Securely locked in a sturdy container, cabinet or room that cannot be easily broken into
  • Except if: (1) in areas where it is legal to fire a gun, non-restricted firearms needed for predator control can temporarily be left unlocked and operable, but they must be kept unloaded and all ammunition must be stored separately, and (2) in wilderness areas, non-restricted firearms can be left unlocked and/or operable, but must be left unloaded (ammunition may be kept nearby).

Restricted firearms must be unloaded and either:
  • Made inoperable with a secure locking device (such as a trigger lock) and securely locked in a sturdy container, cabinet or room that cannot be easily broken into; or
  • Locked in a vault, safe or room that was built or adapted for storing these types of firearms
  • For automatic firearms, the bolt(s) or bolt-carrier(s) must be removed, if removable, and stored in a separate locked room that cannot be easily broken into

Ammunition:
  • Having ammunition kept in a location where it is not available for loading the firearm, unless both the firearm and its ammunition are securely locked up is recommended, however is not required.
Transportation[edit]
  • Non-restricted firearms left unattended in a car must be locked in the trunk or in a similar lockable compartment. If the vehicle does not have a trunk or compartment, the firearm must be placed out of sight inside the vehicle and the vehicle must be locked (same rules apply for transport of replica firearms)
  • Non-restricted firearms must be: transported unloaded (with the exception of muzzle-loading rifles, which can be transported loaded between hunting sites so long as the firing cap or flint is removed).
  • Restricted and prohibited firearms must be: unloaded, made inoperable with a secure locking device, and locked in a sturdy container. Prohibited firearms must also have their bolts or bolt-carriers removed, if removable.

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#3897 Balloon guy

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Posted Yesterday, 09:06 PM

Given that chart showing Canada having a lot more guns per capita than almost every country ( except the USA #1) it seems that the people that do own guns must own a lot of guns.

So you argument become one of responsibility, because a gun owner in Canada needs only unlock their safe to gain access. Even suicidal ones.

Take out gang shootings and suddenly the USA isn't anywhere near as bad as the numbers imply.

75,000,000 gun owners( almost twice the population of Canada ) 300,000,000+ guns legally owned, the number of gun shootings is not nearly the epidemic the news media wants to imply.

Mass shooting in a Christian church a couple weeks ago by guy was stopped because the usher tackled him, then got his own gun from his car and held him.

Responsible gun owners are not the problem, nor are guns themselves.
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#3898 FCP Bob

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Posted Today, 12:54 AM

everybody likes to think of themselves as being responsible gun owners just like everybody is an above average driver
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