345 replies to this topic

[Balloon guy]

Mills, on Sunday, January 17th, 2010, 3:47 PM, said:

which part dont you agree with?

vbnautilus, on Sunday, January 17th, 2010, 4:14 PM, said:

That natural selection has a purpose, and that its main concern is with organisms surviving.

Mills, on Sunday, January 17th, 2010, 4:22 PM, said:

well, yea, i get that i was wrong about that... but in the highlighted section all I said was that was the purpose it serves, as in, that's what it does.. Or do you object the word 'purpose' having anything to do with the term 'natural selection...' yea.. I see what ur sayin

Oh for crying out loud Mills grow a pair.VB is wrong here, you know he's wrong and you're too much of a sycophant to call him on it.I know you created this problem when you tried to tag vb earlier when you had dug a hole that you knew you were not getting out, but the Masked Hippy is not tagging you to relieve you, he is tagging you out of all further discussions.If you don't defend your position, albeit wrong position, then you will lose all self-respect and will be a door mat your whole life.Now call vb the dirty hippy he is, and express your claim that evolution does in fact care about the furtherance of the species like a man.Otherwise ALLLLLLL your future planned "You don't know what evolution is" comments will be tainted with the stench of hypocrisy.Do you really want to so easily lay down your principles and let vb castrate you?Used to be a time when a man would fight for his honor, even though honor is completely at odds with the notion of a natural selection and in fact places another huge problem on the lie of evolution's doorstep by being around at all.

[Balloon guy]

Randy Reed, on Sunday, January 17th, 2010, 10:15 AM, said:

And what exactly is the "purpose" of life? The purpose of existence?This is totally semantics but if there is a purpose in life it perhaps is RNA's "desire" to self-replicate.

The purpose of life is to love God.When this is accomplished, the rest of life makes much more sense.

[vbnautilus]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 10:38 AM, said:

So you don't serve yourself by being selfish?

Correct. Because you are not actually separate from everything else.

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And this is because Natural Selection is able to step out of the individual and appreciate the collective whole of the species? Kind of like the trees in Avatar?

"Natural selection" does not do any appreciating. NS is just our description of a phenomenon within the interconnected Pandora-like nature that we live in.

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 10:47 AM, said:

Oh for crying out loud Mills grow a pair.VB is wrong here, you know he's wrong and you're too much of a sycophant to call him on it.I know you created this problem when you tried to tag vb earlier when you had dug a hole that you knew you were not getting out, but the Masked Hippy is not tagging you to relieve you, he is tagging you out of all further discussions.If you don't defend your position, albeit wrong position, then you will lose all self-respect and will be a door mat your whole life.Now call vb the dirty hippy he is, and express your claim that evolution does in fact care about the furtherance of the species like a man.Otherwise ALLLLLLL your future planned "You don't know what evolution is" comments will be tainted with the stench of hypocrisy.Do you really want to so easily lay down your principles and let vb castrate you?Used to be a time when a man would fight for his honor, even though honor is completely at odds with the notion of a natural selection and in fact places another huge problem on the lie of evolution's doorstep by being around at all.

BG really stepping up his game this week. This is good stuff.

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 10:51 AM, said:

The purpose of life is to love God.When this is accomplished, the rest of life makes much more sense.

Exhibit A: What happens when a man falls in love with his ideas. Literally.

[Randy Reed]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 10:51 AM, said:

The purpose of life is to love God.When this is accomplished, the rest of life makes much more sense.

Why?

[Balloon guy]

Randy Reed, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 12:46 PM, said:

Why?

Isaiah 29:16You turn things around! Shall the potter be considered as equal with the clay, That what is made would say to its maker, "He did not make me"; Or what is formed say to him who formed it, "He has no understanding "?New American Standard Bible (©1995)

[Balloon guy]

vbnautilus, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 12:31 PM, said:

Correct. Because you are not actually separate from everything else.

I don't know if I should break out my Johnathan Livingston Seagull books, or my feminist manifesto.

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"Natural selection" does not do any appreciating. NS is just our description of a phenomenon within the interconnected Pandora-like nature that we live in.

Pandora...I am seeing a pattern

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BG really stepping up his game this week. This is good stuff.

SSSHHHH, I got a new play toy now that crow has left ( finally)

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Exhibit A: What happens when a man falls in love with his ideas. Literally.

Pretty cool how I invented my ideas before I was born...It's a gift

[vbnautilus]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 1:08 PM, said:

It's a gift

or a virus.

[Randy Reed]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 10:51 AM, said:

The purpose of life is to love God.When this is accomplished, the rest of life makes much more sense.

Okay, I'm in. Which one though? I was looking at Gods associated with creation and came up with these,Pan-gu from China's middle kingdon (yin/yang)Japan- Izanagi and Izanami who tooka spear and stirred up the earthThe Hindi Rig Veda who had a 1000 heads, eyes and feetThe greeks had Gaia (mother earth) who created Uranus as the sky to wrap around herself.Bor the Norse GodAhura Mazda (Zoroastrian)Apgu and Tiamat from BabylonAtum who willed himself into creationCoallicue the Earth Mother(had a necklace of hearts)Or simply the God of the Jews, Christians and Islams who made the earth in 6 days and then let Eve eat the appleI'm undecided.

[Mills]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 10:47 AM, said:

Oh for crying out loud Mills grow a pair.VB is wrong here, you know he's wrong and you're too much of a sycophant to call him on it.I know you created this problem when you tried to tag vb earlier when you had dug a hole that you knew you were not getting out, but the Masked Hippy is not tagging you to relieve you, he is tagging you out of all further discussions.

Not quite, I'm just not arrogant enough to assume I know more about biology then a scientist does, particulary one who has shown he is extremley compitent on the subject.He is right. Natural selection is not "inteligent," there is no purpose behind what it does, it just does.

[Mills]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 1:08 PM, said:

SSSHHHH, I got a new play toy now that crow has left ( finally)

creepy

[Balloon guy]

Randy Reed, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 1:48 PM, said:

Okay, I'm in. Which one though? I was looking at Gods associated with creation and came up with these,Pan-gu from China's middle kingdon (yin/yang)Japan- Izanagi and Izanami who tooka spear and stirred up the earthThe Hindi Rig Veda who had a 1000 heads, eyes and feetThe greeks had Gaia (mother earth) who created Uranus as the sky to wrap around herself.Bor the Norse GodAhura Mazda (Zoroastrian)Apgu and Tiamat from BabylonAtum who willed himself into creationCoallicue the Earth Mother(had a necklace of hearts)Or simply the God of the Jews, Christians and Islams who made the earth in 6 days and then let Eve eat the appleI'm undecided.

The fact that you give equal standing to anything that makes any vague reference to being God shows that you are not being honest in your search.I would suggest you read the Bible, the New testament first.This should give you a good beginning point to understand which one.

[Balloon guy]

Mills, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 1:51 PM, said:

Not quite, I'm just not arrogant enough to assume I know more about biology then a scientist does, particulary one who has shown he is extremley compitent on the subject.He is right. Natural selection is not "inteligent," there is no purpose behind what it does, it just does.

Solely?

[vbnautilus]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 2:13 PM, said:

The fact that you give equal standing to anything that makes any vague reference to being God shows that you are not being honest in your search.I would suggest you read the Bible, the New testament first.This should give you a good beginning point to understand which one.

I agree with this. It effectively rules out the Jewish and Christian gods.

[Balloon guy]

vbnautilus, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 2:14 PM, said:

I agree with this. It effectively rules out the Jewish and Christian gods.

Yea...Jesus never said He was God... You have either been led astray, or are completely blind to what the Bible says.

[BaseJester]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 1:32 PM, said:

I don't understand how you could get to that statement from what I said.I am only saying that the discussion is not off the table, and many have made the connection and acted on it. Therefore I am not saying it must become, I am saying it has led and therefore should be discussed.[SNIP]and don't forget I am not bringing this up randomly, there is a flow of the conversation that arrived at that point. you are kind of jumping in mid conversation and acting like my statement is the beginning.

I thought the flow of the conversation was about the plausibility of evolution. So, if I read you right now, eugenics has nothing to do with the plausibility of evolution. So why did you bring it up? Facts don't dictate ethics & values.

[BaseJester]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 5:13 PM, said:

I would suggest you read the Bible, the New testament first.

So, it's like Star Wars in this respect? Why didn't God write in the intended reading order?

[Balloon guy]

BaseJester, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 2:52 PM, said:

So, it's like Star Wars in this respect? Why didn't God write in the intended reading order?

You can start OT first, as long as you are going to read it all.Think of it more like a quick start guide to the whole manual.

[Balloon guy]

BaseJester, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 2:50 PM, said:

I thought the flow of the conversation was about the plausibility of evolution. So, if I read you right now, eugenics has nothing to do with the plausibility of evolution. So why did you bring it up? Facts don't dictate ethics & values.

I only brought it up because during that particular moment of the debate it was a good way to try to get the other side to open their mind to the reality that both sides have warts that can be damaging to their cause, but that just as I don't think not understanding the ways of God completely means I can't know enough of them to trust God, and their side should realize that just because eugenics is a discipline based on evolution, it isn't the only direction we can go.

[vbnautilus]

nevermind

[BaseJester]

Balloon guy, on Monday, January 18th, 2010, 5:57 PM, said:

I only brought it up because during that particular moment of the debate it was a good way to try to get the other side to open their mind to the reality that both sides have warts that can be damaging to their cause . . .

It's the definition of the "sides" that I have a problem with.It's very easy to divide the world into 2 sides like this:People who are like meEverybody elseThat's all well and good until we try to talk to someone else with a different frame of reference. Anybody can try to gerrymander the dividing lines so that the opposition includes the undesirable parties (perhaps Nazis or terrorists) but it doesn't further the debate.

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. . . but that just as I don't think not understanding the ways of God completely means I can't know enough of them to trust God, and their side should realize that just because eugenics is a discipline based on evolution, it isn't the only direction we can go.

I think I missed a question like this on the SAT.Incomplete knowledge of God is to trusting God as Eugenics is based on evolution is to not necessarily practicing eugenicsThis smells like something I might agree with but it breaks my parser so I'm not sure.