14 replies to this topic

[Thenuts]

Starting off... I love this game and am trying my hardest to learn everything I can so I can eventually become a winning player. Secondly I have no idea what to do in the situation i'm about to explain and would really like some help.Full ring game at a 1/2 nlhe brick and mortar casino. I bought in for $100 and sat down at seat 6.Didnt scout any tables , just put my name on the list so I didnt have to wait for very long.Seat 1 has about 500 in front of him, seat 3 about 200 in front of him, and seat 8 about 400 in front of him. At any given time seat 1,3, or 8 would make it somewhere between 14 and 17 to go preflop almost everyhand. I understand its hard to find a table where 3x the big blind is standard anymore but how do you combat this? It kind of took me out of my comfort level and I stayed for a couple of hours playing only a few hands that were limped hoping to flop a set when I got the chance but it never happened. Bascially I was forced to play scared poker. I ended up leaving with half my buyin and puzzled as how to neutralize the situation. Making a stand is necessary at some point I think but I never picked up a hand where I would have been comfortable doing that because there was a large amount of action after the flop and unless I hit it hard I really had no room to maneuver. Any thoughts, critisism, or suggestions would be helpful.Thanks

[SuperJon]

Is $100 the max buy in?If not, then buy in for the max or at least $200. If you can't afford it yet, then wait until you can.As for your table situation, I wouldn't treat it any differently than you would at any other 1/2 live game. Just sit and play good hands, and get paid off.The only difference I see is that against these aggressive players, 3betting hands you normally wouldn't against the standard passive/nit at most 1/2 games becomes okay to do.

[rrumsey]

play very tight long ball with these boys. super tight pre.

[hartman72]

Playing more is the best practice. You will come to find out that these are the tables you dream of when you sit down at a 1/2 game. Sure, you won't be able to play as many hands, but the rewards will be much greater than a table of nits.

[KingJames]

3bet jam like 99+ AJo+ and KQs

[Pot Odds RAC]

 Thenuts, on Wednesday, August 25th, 2010, 12:59 PM, said:

Starting off... I love this game and am trying my hardest to learn everything I can so I can eventually become a winning player. Secondly I have no idea what to do in the situation i'm about to explain and would really like some help.Full ring game at a 1/2 nlhe brick and mortar casino. I bought in for $100 and sat down at seat 6.Didnt scout any tables , just put my name on the list so I didnt have to wait for very long.Seat 1 has about 500 in front of him, seat 3 about 200 in front of him, and seat 8 about 400 in front of him. At any given time seat 1,3, or 8 would make it somewhere between 14 and 17 to go preflop almost everyhand. I understand its hard to find a table where 3x the big blind is standard anymore but how do you combat this? It kind of took me out of my comfort level and I stayed for a couple of hours playing only a few hands that were limped hoping to flop a set when I got the chance but it never happened. Bascially I was forced to play scared poker. I ended up leaving with half my buyin and puzzled as how to neutralize the situation. Making a stand is necessary at some point I think but I never picked up a hand where I would have been comfortable doing that because there was a large amount of action after the flop and unless I hit it hard I really had no room to maneuver. Any thoughts, critisism, or suggestions would be helpful.Thanks

This was exactly their goal and it worked.Sort of reminds me of one of my very first threads when I started posting at this Forum.

Quote

http://www.fullconta...u...c=72723&hl=I am still "working on my game" and find that my comfort zone is $100 max buy-in for $1/$2 Blind NL TxHE - Casino Live GameRecently I was playing against a guy who at a full table (seated directly to my right, so he was always acting immediately before me) would raise $10 literally every hand preflop. This was an obvious attempt to eliminate limpers and then concentrate on out playing others after the flop. Initially, it really took me and most others at the table out of our comfort zone, so while annoying, it was effective.I found this annoying because basically what he was doing was turning the "kiddie table" into a $12 blind table. I consider that sort of bottom feeding. If he is man enough to play at a higher stakes table then he should go sit at one instead of pushing around relative beginners at the $1/$2 table.His strategy worked well for a couple of orbits and he built a good sized stack. However after getting a little annoyed, I found a strategy that semed to work against this loose/aggressive style. First I set him up with a couple of well timed bluffs to steal his pre-flop raises. Then I quickly tightened up, only playing VERY quality hands. He turned into a calling station. A couple of other guys quickly adopted the very tight approach to break this guy.Any obesrvations on this guy's approach and strategies to combat it?

...and of course I got some well intended responses such as:

 Zach6668, on Sunday, August 27th, 2006, 4:01 PM, said:

Man, thinking that his strategy is low is just retarded.It's poker. He's there to make money. His strategy was effective because he found a table full of people playing scared, apparently.The best way to defend agaisnt this guy is to come over the top more often. If he's raising every hand, then you don't need a tremendous hand to beat him.You were on his direct left! I'd have a big chubby if I were in that situation. 3-bet to isolate baby! OR, take down $10 extra each time PF.- Zach

...and...

 iggymcfly, on Sunday, August 27th, 2006, 9:51 PM, said:

I will never for the life of me understand people who complain about loose action. I mean, god, he's bored, he's doing the rest of the table a giant favor, and you're complaining about it? Give me a ****ing break.(Sorry if I'm a little testy, but where I play there aren't any live games higher than 1/2 most of the time, and I can identify with Mr. Preflop Raiser a lot more than you. You sir, are a prick.)

...and...

 Royal_Tour, on Monday, August 28th, 2006, 2:35 PM, said:

No offence but i agree with IggyYOu're in a casino gambling. You knew what you got into, you shouldnt be playing with money you cant afford to lose, so with that in mind, he has every right to raise whatever he wants, regardless of limits.Kiddie table?? here is a tip, Dont Gamble

Bottom line is, this is a scenario that you can easily work to your advantage. These guys will actually do your dirty work for you.

[Ninja Ace]

If you can't buy in full and are trying to learn the game I highly suggest playing online first. $100 can be a bankroll online.

[Pot Odds RAC]

Five years into my "Poker Career" and I'm still learning how to handle Hyper Aggression. However, it really is easy to take advantage of unbridled aggression. An example from my most recent session. There were a couple of guys who were betting and raising often preflop. One in particular had been very active. MP had bumped to $12 and from the CO this guy bets $125. In a $1/$2 game. Fold to hero who'd limped with Pocket Fives. I think for a couple of moments and Fold. Guy to my immediate left wants to call, but eventually folds and flashes me his Pocket Threes. Original bettor folds and Hyper Aggression Dude (HAD) takes the pot.Two hands later I am in the SB with A9s (My most common hand of the evening). Several limpers, including HAD. Hero & BB Limp. Flop is A Q 9 Rainbow. Hero and rest of table limp to HAD who, as expected bets $35. Fold to Hero who pauses and raises to $100. Fold to HAD who tanks and is reconstructing the brief hand out loud. He asks how much I have left and I show. He cuts out a call. He cuts out enough to put me all in. He tanks some more.By this point I am not only 100% certain he has a naked Ace, I also know he's going to reraise me. I just need to be patient. The longer he takes to act the more confident I am that I have him dominated.Sure enough after a few minutes he eventually reraises enough to cover me and I snap call.He shows AJ and I just need to fade the Q, J, and runner-runner.I call for a Black 4 which comes on the Turn and the River 9 boats me to complete my double up.

[Ninja Ace]

 Pot Odds RAC, on Wednesday, August 25th, 2010, 12:51 PM, said:

Five years into my "Poker Career" and I'm still learning how to handle Hyper Aggression.

Play tightNever call only repopWiden your stackoff rangeThe only way to deal with a bully is to punch him in the nose

[BaseJester]

Since the raise is so much of your stack, you have to play the opposite of fit or fold: play only cards that don't have to fit and don't fold after the flop.

[TheTiburon]

THIS is how I learned how to play poker and I absolutely clean up on these tables. Here are some suggestions and rules to follow:1. Establish a solid poker image of TAG (Tight Aggressive)2. Buyin for the table max and spend the first hour playing ABC getting reads from people. Don't get into trickery or doing anything outside of collecting information and looking to exploit the weak, trap the tricky or stack off on the donkeys that overplay top pair/chase every draw (even gut shots).3. I learned this from Daniel, get involved in conversation with guys about what they do, how often they play and even let them talk about strategy without participating. 4. Play patient and disciplined until you start to exploit your reads. 5. Have a plan and strategy for EVERY hand. If you are going to invest some of your money, have a plan for getting it back. 6. Position, position, position on every plan you orchestrate.7. For the love of God, pay attention to the calling stations and NEVER bluff at them. Value bet them!The hyper aggressives i LOVE! I trap them with two pair and trips all the time. From position I will speculate with Suited connectors, suited 1 gappers, small pairs, etc... Be prepared to be put at odds for all of your chips often with the hypers.

[trystero]

 KingJames, on Wednesday, August 25th, 2010, 3:05 PM, said:

3bet jam like 99+ AJo+ and KQs

What have you done with King James

[Thenuts]

Thanks for all the insight everyone I appreciate the help.

[mtdesmoines]

 Pot Odds RAC, on Wednesday, August 25th, 2010, 3:51 PM, said:

Five years into my "Poker Career" and I'm still learning how to handle Hyper Aggression.

If we're sitting on 100 stack, we should be shoving 77 AT + into these guys imo

[fighter]

While I agree that you need to play lower if you are playing scared. I don't agree with the others that you need to be 100BB deep live. If you are learning poker, you probably should buy in smaller so that your mistakes are not as costly. While playing deeper should be a long term goal. In the short term, just playing hands and getting use to pre flop and flop play can be easily achieved through shorter stack play. You will likely cover most of the really bad players anyway and occasionally double up early and still get a full session in with deeper stacks. The arguement for playing deeper is that your edge increases the deeper relative stacks are. Well this guy isn't a winning player since he is just starting, his will only lose more money in less time. The deeper you play, the harder poker becomes. If you are feeling lost with a 50bb stack , feeling lost with a 100bb stack will come up much more frequently and it will only cost you more money. While it could be agrued that you will learn quicker, this however is subjective and you have to weigh it up againt how much more you are losing. While this can be a non issue online with micro stakes, live this should be a consideration since the marginal utility of the money you are gambling with is much much higher. When you start to realise where and why you have an edge, You will start buying in for full anyway.