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horribly played hand leads to weird river decision.


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Villian is 10/0/0 only over 40 hands.FCP, 10-handed.I get K :club: K :) UTG+1PRE-FLOP:1 fold, I raise, steve-o-21 folds, 2 folds, CO calls, Button 3-bets, blinds fold, I cap, CO folds, Button calls.FLOP (11.5sb)J :D Q :) 4 :) (2 players)I checks, Button bets, I call.TURN (6.5bb): 2 :D I check, Button checks.RIVER (6.5bb): 8 :D I bet, Button raises, I fold.I think my flop/turn plan was pretty wrong. Tell me why.I don't really know if my river fold is best, but it felt right at the time.

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You folded river? Im surprised. If button has a set, he value bets turn, not checks it. His raise smells more like AQ, or AJ, then set or flush.Edit, its wrong because you are doing no betting. You didn't bet flop? Its doubful here that he flopped a flush, so bet and find out what he's holding. Check/call, is a very weak play. I mightve c/r here and if 3 bet MAYBE lay it down, as he most likely has a set.Now you couldve made the turn interesting, if you come out betting here. Maybe your intention was c/r here, which isn't a bad one, but I still bet here for value after your check call. For all you know, he's bought his free card.I think your river bet/fold was pretty weak. You don't have alot of info on this guy, and I'd pay him off for 1 bet in order to see what and how he plays.

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It's not april 1st. What the hell is this supposed to be?I think ive got it.You were the villain in question, and the hero with kings is the "other" guy. That explains why you manually input the hole cards, and the atypically weak play. I take it that you had AK or a small-mid pair like 66/77 and you raised the river as a bluff, and you're questioning whether it makes sense. Am i right?

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It's not april 1st. What the hell is this supposed to be?I think ive got it.You were the villain in question, and the hero with kings is the "other" guy. That explains why you manually input the hole cards, and the atypically weak play. I take it that you had AK or a small-mid pair like 66/77 and you raised the river as a bluff, and you're questioning whether it makes sense. Am i right?
Bingo!very good
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Screech.... did you let someone else on your account?!?  What the hell is going on here?!
:club: I know. I felt like something was very wrong after I played this hand. But it was me who played it. I didn't really think things through logically during the hand, I just went more on intuition. That flop sent off alarm bells in my head and I kind of just turtled up.Anyone care to put villian on a range of hands? I know I have a very small sample size of data, but I think it's safe enough to assume he is very tight and very passive. Looking back on the hand, I feel like my instincts were right, but I also feel like there's a better way to play this hand. Put villian on a range and give me a line. I need help.
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Is it possible he had A :club: J(any). This would give him the nut flush draw. and middle pair. nut flush draw is worth a bet and middle pair is worth a bet to see where he stand. he doesnt hit the :D on the turn and loves the fact that u checked, bc that shows that you dont have the flush either, since you havent taken the role of the agressor in betting. he thinks maybe u have a Q (weak kicker) and are scared of the flush. he takes a free card hoping for another diamond. no diamond, but thinks ur bet is weak so raises you.That is my best guess as to what happened on that hand. I can understand your hesitation. But i think even after the :D flop u have to show some aggression to see where you stand.

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Is it possible he had A  J(any). This would give him the nut flush draw. and middle pair. nut flush draw is worth a bet and middle pair is worth a bet to see where he stand. he doesnt hit the  on the turn and loves the fact that u checked, bc that shows that you dont have the flush either, since you havent taken the role of the agressor in betting. he thinks maybe u have a Q (weak kicker) and are scared of the flush.
I don't think this guy is 3-betting pf with AdJx or AdQx.The range I put him on was AA-JJ, and AK. The only hands I'm ahead of on this flop are the AK hands that don't contain a diamond. Those hands have 7 outs to beat me.Against the AK hands that have a diamond, I'm a slight underdog. They have 15 outs to win.Against all his other hands, I'm an big dog.Still, the flop felt wrong. Maybe I should be betting for info? Should I bet/fold this flop? Maybe even check/fold is best given how passive this guy is?I don't know. Someone give me a line.
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Still' date=' the flop felt wrong. Maybe I should be betting for info? Should I bet/fold this flop? Maybe even check/fold is best given how passive this guy is?I don't know. Someone give me a line.[/quote']Your right. AJ would be a stretch to 3 bet. Like Steve Dannenman said at the final table last year, "not calling a raise is only a small mistake." dont beat yourself up over it. i think a bet after the flop would have given you some info about his hand and made you live with your decision a little bit easier. but you had a bad feeling from the start and no point in going against your gut if nothing that had happened pointed in your favor.
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I bet the flop. If raised, I re-raise with the Kd for sure, if no Kd, then I may raise or call depending on feel. Probably just call and then check call all the way to the end (assuming 4th diamond does not appear). I think I would rather spend my $ toward the showdown. I go passive on the turn b/c if I bet out on the turn and am raised I am forced to a decision I don't want. If I call his turn raise, I already could have had a showdown for the same price by c/c the turn and river. As this hand played out, I would bet until I was raised and then I would check/call the rest of the way. I think you needed to call the river raise, otherwise you never should have bet out. If nothing else you get info on how they guy plays by seeing his hand on the end. Unfortunately I don't have PT so this is how I have to find out how people play. I'll have to work on getting PT someday soon.

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why such a tight range?He won't 3-bet 99/TT, AQs, KQs, 88 ....40 hands.
Yeah, but he hasn't raised once over 40 hands. I think it's safe to assume his raising standards are tight. At highest, it may be like 5%. More likely, is that it's something like 3%. Do you really think someone that hasn't raised once in 40 hands is going to 3-bet those hands you just named? Maybe TT. But it's unlikely.I know that I don't have a lot of hands on this guy, but am I supposed to ignore PT altogther and assume he would play like me? I'd rather use the stats and realize the error present in a small sample size.
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But how can you put him on a set? I mean he checks turn for god sakes. A set bets thats turn every time. I think the only thing you could up against is AA, no diamond (he wouldve bet turn as well if he did, or at least should bet turn).

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Can you name a hand that checks the turn but raises the riverive got 88, that's it.
But how about his 3 bet preflop? I rule out JJ or QQ, because of the way he passively plays turn. Maybe 10s, who called BS on his river bet, putting him on AK. Like I said in the earlier post, AA is quite a possibility. AQ, and AJ as well. However, I don't think he has a diamond, as probably AQ or AJ mustve been suited.
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Why would you feel bad about calling?He won nearly the bare minimum.Something similar happened to me earlier. I had AQ, raised, was 3bet by a guy who had position. flop came ragged all of one suit. My ace was of that suit. I was going to checkraise the flop, but he checked through. Turn was a blank, checked through again. River was a queen. I bet, he raised, i called. He had kings. He deceived you into paying him off at the cost of missing out tons of value on earlier streets. It definitely wasnt worth it in this situation, and i dont think there are any possible hands you could have had that would have made his line a good one.

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oven's buzzing, so i didn't read replies and can't say anything interesting, but...river fold is terrible. i hate being OOP here since i'd be comfortable 3-betting if i wasn't afraid of a cap. if it was possible, i think this is a reraise/fold situation!he checked the turn...he could easily have AQ/AJ here, or even something less. you played it so weak, and it seems like you only bet the river as a bluff, he could even have something like A10/AK here.reraise/fold this river IMO :club:

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Hi, what's the limit?If it's higher than .05/.10 you're playing way too high.good luck.
3/6.I know my winrate is not as good as it could be. That's why I post hands, and why I felt I played this one like shit. But I really don't know what better line to take against such a passive player. Bet/fold the flop? Bet/call down unless a diamond or an ace hits? All I've heard so far is bet the flop. Nothing else really. No one has bothered to put villian on a range, and no one has bothered to give me a good line. I don't know. Enlighten me.
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Hi, what's the limit?If it's higher than .05/.10 you're playing way too high.good luck.
3/6.I know my winrate is not as good as it could be. That's why I post hands, and why I felt I played this one like censored. But I really don't know what better line to take against such a passive player. Bet/fold the flop? Bet/call down unless a diamond or an ace hits? I don't know. Enlighten me.
i'd say ignore smash because he's just being a dick, but he has barely been a dick at all since he came back and has been giving good advice. oh well.nevertheless, this is just FPS. even on the flop you almost certainly have the best hand. so just keep bet/raising. if the guy keeps playing back at you to the point where you think he's gotta have JJ or QQ, then you can just start calling.preflop: perfect.flop: bet. bet bet bet. not a great flop for you, but there is no ace, so you probably still have the best hand here. JJ, QQ and AA are all still possibilities, but you want to find out soon, so you know by the expensive streets. betting gets you far more information.usually i bet/raise here. if he raises the flop, then caps my reraise, i probably bet/call a non-diamond on the turn, and bet/fold a diamond.unless a diamond comes on the turn or river, i am showing down this hand every time.no offense, but you played the hand terribly. you almost certainly have the best hand preflop and without an ace on the flop, you want to keep pounding it until you're almost certainly behind. you have no information on the flop or turn, and no bets go in while you probably have excellent equity. then you fold the river when you could easily be ahead.i know you are a better player than this screech, and playing an overpair out of position on a flush board is not the easiest. but if you are really having trouble playing hands like this, i really do think you need to move down and regather yourself, or reread SSHE.cheers,daniel
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