Official Toronto Maple Leafs Thread

[serge 904]

Andrew Ferrence better get suspended. Piece of shit

[digitalmonkey 929]

So Dave and Serge...how many Bruins would you like to punch in the face? Doesn't take long does it?

 

And the Boston crowd always seems to be one giant collective *******.

[serge 904]

So Dave and Serge...how many Bruins would you like to punch in the face? Doesn't take long does it?

 

And the Boston crowd always seems to be one giant collective *******.

 

A lot. Most. Led by their fat coach.

 

 

[serge 904]

Lol. I'm getting chirped on Facebook from my 13 year old cousin

[serge 904]

Reality set in. We are in tough against Boston.

 

We are far from being out of this. Good coaching can turn this around.

 

Carlyle is maybe doing too much line matching though. Several times bad changes led to odd man rushes.

 

Not a fan of having Orr and Mclaren in lineup. Like to see Frattin or maybe Colborne.

 

The score was actually flattering to the Leafs. Reimer played solid

[mrdannyg 274]

You think Reimer played solid? 40 shots is nothing to sneeze at, but 2-3 of Boston's goals weren't even really scoring chances. Maybe he was screened on Redden's goal, but it was a weak screen, at best. Boychuk's was awful. Krejci's was a tough one in a scramble (though didn't seem like he was ready for any shot, and since the scramble was several feet from the net, I think he should've been better positioned). Horton's was impossible.

 

So maybe he "should've" given up more like 3 goals than 4 (no difference), but I think when you give up goals on shots like Redden and Boychuk, you can't be called solid, and those are the kinds of goals that make your teammates start to play differently (not that they will after one game when he's been awesome all year of course), which is the opposite of solid.

[FCP Bob 1,323]

Good coaching can turn this around.

 

 

 

in that case the Leafs are screwed

[serge 904]

You think Reimer played solid? 40 shots is nothing to sneeze at, but 2-3 of Boston's goals weren't even really scoring chances. Maybe he was screened on Redden's goal, but it was a weak screen, at best. Boychuk's was awful. Krejci's was a tough one in a scramble (though didn't seem like he was ready for any shot, and since the scramble was several feet from the net, I think he should've been better positioned). Horton's was impossible.

 

So maybe he "should've" given up more like 3 goals than 4 (no difference), but I think when you give up goals on shots like Redden and Boychuk, you can't be called solid, and those are the kinds of goals that make your teammates start to play differently (not that they will after one game when he's been awesome all year of course), which is the opposite of solid.

 

Not sure if you watched the same game, or just highlites..On numerous occasions terrible neutral zone giveaways led to pointless chances..He made some brilliant saves to make the score respectable. All the goals can be directly related to bad defence and terrible giveaways....

[serge 904]

in that case the Leafs are screwed

 

I m not sure if you are taking a shot at Carlyle or not, but he has done a great job this year IMO.

[Fenxis 99]

I m not sure if you are taking a shot at Carlyle or not, but he has done a great job this year IMO.

 

There was a good point on the radio this morning -- all night long Boston exploited Carlyle's need to match lineups to create odd-man rushes. Also he has his d-men play a very basic dump the puck up the boards dzone exit which is easy to plan against. A good coach will adjust before the next game, a great coach will adjust mid-game.

[FCP Bob 1,323]

I m not sure if you are taking a shot at Carlyle or not, but he has done a great job this year IMO.

 

I think his use of personnel is horrible. It was for sure a shot at Carlyle.

 

The goons shouldn't be in the lineup and when Mark Fraser gets more ice time than any player on either team that is a problem.

 

Frattin and Gardiner need to be in the lineup. Part of the Leafs problem last night was that the defense couldn't make that first pass or get out of the defensive zone and Gardiner is the best player the Leafs have at that. Sure he's going to make some mistakes but the good he brings far outweigh the bad.

 

Kadri and Kessell both only were on the ice for 13 minutes.

[FCP Bob 1,323]

Let's focus on the good.

 

JVR seems to really step up his game in the playoffs. He did it in Philly and he was by far the best Leaf last night.

[serge 904]

I think his use of personnel is horrible. It was for sure a shot at Carlyle.

 

The goons shouldn't be in the lineup and when Mark Fraser gets more ice time than any player on either team that is a problem.

 

Frattin and Gardiner need to be in the lineup. Part of the Leafs problem last night was that the defense couldn't make that first pass or get out of the defensive zone and Gardiner is the best player the Leafs have at that. Sure he's going to make some mistakes but the good he brings far outweigh the bad.

 

Kadri and Kessell both only were on the ice for 13 minutes.

 

I totally agree about the goons..There is NO reason to have Orr and Mclaren in the lineup..Frattin hasnt done ANYTHING since coming back from injury and Gardiner is lost out there at times, but I agree they should get a shot.

 

He is all about line matching, and usually its his forte..Yesterday it hurt him..They showed a stat where before one of the goals couple of the players were stuck on the ice for over a 2 minute shift..Stuff like that cant happen against the Bruins..

 

The Leafs have been succesful all year because of his personnel decisions and his coaching, dumping on him because of one game isnt fair..

[FCP Bob 1,323]

I totally agree about the goons..There is NO reason to have Orr and Mclaren in the lineup..Frattin hasnt done ANYTHING since coming back from injury and Gardiner is lost out there at times, but I agree they should get a shot.

 

He is all about line matching, and usually its his forte..Yesterday it hurt him..They showed a stat where before one of the goals couple of the players were stuck on the ice for over a 2 minute shift..Stuff like that cant happen against the Bruins..

 

The Leafs have been succesful all year because of his personnel decisions and his coaching, dumping on him because of one game isnt fair..

 

I think he's been dumped on all year on how he has used the goons and the way he hasn't used Gardiner

[Dubey 1,035]

Sorry Serge, you won't like this post:

 

 

 

 

Randy Carlyle is horrible.

 

I knew we were screwed about 5 minutes before game time when they posted the lines. Orr and Mclaren in the lineup for a playoff game is inexcusable. They looked like novice goons out there while Boston's 4th line actually *gasp* played hockey and dominated us all night long. I'll concede that we probably were never going to come back in that game, but with 15 minutes left in the third, Carlyle started playing Orr/Mclaren every 2nd shift, basically throwing in the white towel. This is way, way, way too early to be giving up on a 3 goal game as the coach, and is really embarrassing actually. They played almost as much as Kessel, who actually played well

 

Mike Kostka has to go. Whatever Carlyle saw in him at some point in the year that has him going back to Kostka time and time again is gone. I don't know if I've ever seen an NHL defenseman look so overmatched in a game, and that's saying something, as I watch a lot of Oiler's games. He reached Ryan Whitney levels of ineptitude last night. We will not iwn a game in this series if Kostka is playing 20 minutes a night.

 

The breakout. Jesus Christ, the breakout. I've coached 14 year old kids who had a better breakout than the Leafs last night. We must have turned the puck over 50 times trying to get out of our zone, and it always resulted in an odd man rush, as the forwards were flying the zone and the defenseman were trying to flip it to them. This worked precisely zero times. If it was just one or two guys, I'd say it's on the players, but when this is actually the breakout for every single line, I'm gonna look at the coach.

 

Bozak cannot handle first line minutes against the bruins. bring Grabovski up between JVR and Kessel, and put Kadri between Lupul and Kulemin. This will never happen.

 

Reimer was pretty bad. I'm a big Reimer supporter but that first goal was a backbreaker. The 4th goal was inexcusable. He's not the reason we lost but he didn't help our cause. He stopped it from being a laugher, but he didn't give us a chance to win. A lot of pucks were just hitting him and he didn't see them at all. He was constantly looking behind himself after he made a save. He'll have to be better if we are going to win this series.

 

 

 

THE POSITIVES:

 

Yes, there actually were some. Despite that horrible game, I think the Bruins are beatable. We aren't going to do it with toughness, but we can do it with speed. On the rare occasions that we actually got out of our own zone with possesion last night, the Bruins were very succeptible to offensive zone pressure. Their gap control was questionable, and they were letting dangerous shots through to the net. A lot of really prime oppurtunities materialized out of pretty much nothing, and that is encouraging. There are holes in Boston's defense, we just have to find a way to exploit them. It starts with a better lineup, which I pray happens, and a complete change on the way we break out of the zone. If we can leave the zone with possession consistently, everything else will follow. I do trust in our ability to score goals against Boston, but we need the puck first.

[serge 904]

I actually agree with most of what you are saying..Our defence had a brutal game led by Kostka....However the stupid give aways by Kadri,Lupul, Kulemin were inexcusable..They couldnt get the puck out of the zone.

 

Cmon man Bozak cant handle first line minutes against the Bruins? Bozak has done amazing for us the last 2 years..

 

Again I agree with a LOT of what you are saying but saying Randy Carlyle is horrible is a bit far fetched. Was he horrible all year leading this team to the playoffs?

 

I know everyone wants Frattin in there but in the last 15 games he didnt score a goal and registered 3 assists..His game is one dimensional, if he doesnt score he is useless IMO..

 

You can also argue Orr and McLaren are one dimensional, but the formula has worked all year, i was a bit surprised they both were in there, but if the Leafs win 4-2 and dominate physically we arent here second guessing Carlyle.

[FCP Bob 1,323]

 

You can also argue Orr and McLaren are one dimensional, but the formula has worked all year, i was a bit surprised they both were in there, but if the Leafs win 4-2 and dominate physically we arent here second guessing Carlyle.

 

http://sports.nationalpost.com/2013/05/02/nhl-playoff-diary-leafs-pick-a-bad-time-fiddle-with-their-lineup/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

Toronto fought more than any other team in the NHL during the season, but actually had a better record in games in which no gloves were dropped. The Leafs went 15-11-3 when they fought, and 11-6-2 when they did not

[Dubey 1,035]

Carlyle has been making questionable lineup decisions all year, but the Leafs have been winning games in spite of this, so it hasn't come to the forefront.

 

 

Jake Gardiner, even with the occasional defensive gaffe, is probably the third best defenseman on the team. Having him sit in the press box while plugs like Kostka and Fraser are eating up huge minutes and basically spewing goals against is mind boggling.

 

I'm not as big of a Bozak fan as you are, but he had nothing against the Bruins last night. No forecheck, no puck possession, nothing.

 

Frattin may be mostly useless, but he is better at hockey than Orr or mclaren by a factor of about 10. Orr did nothing except hurt the team last night. He ran around a bit, didn't "punish" anybody in any way, and took 3 minor penalties. Removing him and mclaren from the lineup is addition by subtraction. Frattin just happens to be the guy that gets to go in.

 

 

Again, the Leafs have won games all year in spite of Mclaren/Orr playing way too much, not because of it.

 

 

Kadri had a bad game last night but he also wasn't put in a position to suceed. minimal minutes paired with Mcarthur and Komarov. I love Komarov, but he's a 4th liner. A good 4th liner, but a 4th liner nonetheless. That was a horrible line choice that was never going to do anything last night.

[MapleLeafpoker 1,462]

THE STUFF DUBEY SAID

 

I agree with all of it!

 

I watched all of the first+third, and I'd say about half the 2nd. That was easily the most I have watched them all year. Im just gonna repeat the things I really agreed with Dubey on....

 

breakout: beyond awful. What the hell was that?

Reimer: bad. Some good saves, but a couple of terrible goals.

Bozak: showed me nothing. Maybe like Db said, overmatched against B's?

 

And agreeing with Bob.....JVR looked very good last night, like his Philly playoff self. I would have given him an excellent if not that one play.... I was talking to my friends about how he's going to be a stud this playoff year if he keeps it up, and then right then he goofed on that 2nd Boston goal by not playing the puck, and trying to body the man, and not being successful.

[FCP Bob 1,323]

Bozak is probably still not close to 100% healthy

[mrdannyg 274]

Not sure if you watched the same game, or just highlites..On numerous occasions terrible neutral zone giveaways led to pointless chances..He made some brilliant saves to make the score respectable. All the goals can be directly related to bad defence and terrible giveaways....

 

For the first time in forever, I did actually watch the game. I tend to give goalies a lot of leeway when it comes to defensive zone turnovers, because they're very difficult to react to and prepare for. There were A LOT of those.

 

Let's focus on the good.

 

JVR seems to really step up his game in the playoffs. He did it in Philly and he was by far the best Leaf last night.

 

QFT. He has been much better than I expected. A good trade, IMO.

 

Sorry Serge, you won't like this post:

 

Randy Carlyle is horrible.

 

I knew we were screwed about 5 minutes before game time when they posted the lines. Orr and Mclaren in the lineup for a playoff game is inexcusable. They looked like novice goons out there while Boston's 4th line actually *gasp* played hockey and dominated us all night long. I'll concede that we probably were never going to come back in that game, but with 15 minutes left in the third, Carlyle started playing Orr/Mclaren every 2nd shift, basically throwing in the white towel. This is way, way, way too early to be giving up on a 3 goal game as the coach, and is really embarrassing actually. They played almost as much as Kessel, who actually played well

 

Mike Kostka has to go. Whatever Carlyle saw in him at some point in the year that has him going back to Kostka time and time again is gone. I don't know if I've ever seen an NHL defenseman look so overmatched in a game, and that's saying something, as I watch a lot of Oiler's games. He reached Ryan Whitney levels of ineptitude last night. We will not iwn a game in this series if Kostka is playing 20 minutes a night.

 

The breakout. Jesus Christ, the breakout. I've coached 14 year old kids who had a better breakout than the Leafs last night. We must have turned the puck over 50 times trying to get out of our zone, and it always resulted in an odd man rush, as the forwards were flying the zone and the defenseman were trying to flip it to them. This worked precisely zero times. If it was just one or two guys, I'd say it's on the players, but when this is actually the breakout for every single line, I'm gonna look at the coach.

 

Bozak cannot handle first line minutes against the bruins. bring Grabovski up between JVR and Kessel, and put Kadri between Lupul and Kulemin. This will never happen.

 

Reimer was pretty bad. I'm a big Reimer supporter but that first goal was a backbreaker. The 4th goal was inexcusable. He's not the reason we lost but he didn't help our cause. He stopped it from being a laugher, but he didn't give us a chance to win. A lot of pucks were just hitting him and he didn't see them at all. He was constantly looking behind himself after he made a save. He'll have to be better if we are going to win this series.

 

 

 

THE POSITIVES:

 

Yes, there actually were some. Despite that horrible game, I think the Bruins are beatable. We aren't going to do it with toughness, but we can do it with speed. On the rare occasions that we actually got out of our own zone with possesion last night, the Bruins were very succeptible to offensive zone pressure. Their gap control was questionable, and they were letting dangerous shots through to the net. A lot of really prime oppurtunities materialized out of pretty much nothing, and that is encouraging. There are holes in Boston's defense, we just have to find a way to exploit them. It starts with a better lineup, which I pray happens, and a complete change on the way we break out of the zone. If we can leave the zone with possession consistently, everything else will follow. I do trust in our ability to score goals against Boston, but we need the puck first.

 

Love fans like you. The worst play I saw Kostka make was on the Krejci goal. It was the end of a very long shift, and the normal course of the play put him down on one knee and out of position while the puck was scrambling. That's fine. But if you watch the video, he takes a pause at that moment. A significant pause. He doesn't have the ability or confidence to get back in the play at the end of a killer shift, with the puck bouncing dangerously around. If I'm a coach and I see that pause on video, I don't know how you can put the guy out there fore another playoff game.

 

The breakout looked more nervous than anything. I can't comment on the strategy, because I don't understand it and wasn't watching THAT carefully. But on plenty of occasions, they had the opportunity to just ice or clear it, but seemed like they HAD to look for the RIGHT pass, according to how the breakout was designed. And of course, sometimes you just have to get rid of it - can't have a practice-perfect breakout every time. Tons of turnovers came about because they were trying to be too fine. I think next game will say a lot about the coaching - is he someone who demands perfection out of HIS SYSTEM, and the mistakes continue? Or will he reinforce that those perfect breakouts only happen when you have the time to make a pass, and the first priority is clearing out of danger.

[mrdannyg 274]

Bozak is probably still not close to 100% healthy

 

My thoughts too. He seemed a little light on his man a couple times, which is a perfectly reasonable thing to me if your shoulder is in bad shape. Bozak playing at less than 100% is better than no Bozak, so it's just something to deal with I guess.

[Dubey 1,035]

I agree with all of it!

 

I watched all of the first+third, and I'd say about half the 2nd. That was easily the most I have watched them all year. Im just gonna repeat the things I really agreed with Dubey on....

 

breakout: beyond awful. What the hell was that?

Reimer: bad. Some good saves, but a couple of terrible goals.

Bozak: showed me nothing. Maybe like Db said, overmatched against B's?

 

And agreeing with Bob.....JVR looked very good last night, like his Philly playoff self. I would have given him an excellent if not that one play.... I was talking to my friends about how he's going to be a stud this playoff year if he keeps it up, and then right then he goofed on that 2nd Boston goal by not playing the puck, and trying to body the man, and not being successful.

 

 

Yeah JVR was great, but that play was a head scratcher. It's too bad. If that goal goes in, then Boston doesn't score 5 seconds later, and it might have been a totally different game (probably not, but a guy can daydream).

 

 

 

Kessel played well too. He came back and broke up a few good chances defensively. He also used his speed early to almost break in behind Chara but Z was a little too strong on his stick. Ultimately, even the best players in the league are going to sturggle offensively in a 1-on-1 matchup with Chara, Kessel did ok last night, but only getting 13 minutes of ice time was... terrible? I'm not sure that's a strong enough word, but I feel like I'm overusing the words embarrassing and inexcusable.

[FCP Bob 1,323]

terrible? I'm not sure that's a strong enough word, but I feel like I'm overusing the words embarrassing and inexcusable.

 

Head scratchingly stupid ?

[serge 904]

Yeah JVR was great, but that play was a head scratcher. It's too bad. If that goal goes in, then Boston doesn't score 5 seconds later, and it might have been a totally different game (probably not, but a guy can daydream).

 

 

 

Kessel played well too. He came back and broke up a few good chances defensively. He also used his speed early to almost break in behind Chara but Z was a little too strong on his stick. Ultimately, even the best players in the league are going to sturggle offensively in a 1-on-1 matchup with Chara, Kessel did ok last night, but only getting 13 minutes of ice time was... terrible? I'm not sure that's a strong enough word, but I feel like I'm overusing the words embarrassing and inexcusable.

 

I dont have the actual stats but i would bet Orr played more than Kessel in the 3rd period...The game was out of hand, no need to have Kessel out there, if stupidity ensues..This team is full of cheap shot artists and assholes(yes I am bitter)..

 

Here is a story that was retold on the FAN yesterday...Leafs were playing the Canucks in the 1994 Conference final...Gino Odjick who was a goon at the time was being a pest and cheap shotting Doug Gilmour...Dougie came to the bench and told Wendel Clark...Wendel Clark goes on the ice next shift and goes up to Pavel Bure...He told Bure if Odjick doesnt leave Gilmour alone " I will kill you"...After that Gilmour was not bothered the rest of the series.

 

TRUE STORY